Considering reloading .223, can I expect as accurate as premium factory loads?

Hi all,

New target shooter here, got an Axis in .223. I've been experimenting with different ammo brands lately, and I've found that my gun likes the expensive premium ammo. Surprise, surprise. :) Shooting the cheap stuff, like the $8 per box of 20 Winchester white box, the groups are pretty bad, around 2 MOA. Shooting the expensive Hornady match rounds ($20 per box) or the Winchester ballistic silvertip ($25 per box) I get consistent 0.6" groups at 100 yards.

I've been planning to get into reloading anyway, because I think I will really enjoy the process of working up my own loads and the gratification of shooting tight groups with ammo I put together myself. The fact that my gun really likes the expensive ammo makes reloading even more attractive to me and my wallet. :)

So, my big question is, would it be reasonable to expect that I can load my own rounds and get accuracy on par with the expensive stuff I mentioned above, and spend the same or less money as what I'd spend on the cheap stuff?

Thanks for any input or advice!

-Ross

The savings are more long term, and marginal at that in my experience. There are reloading calculators out there to help figure out the exact $ per round.
It took me no time at all to have my ammo equal the best store bought stuff that I've tried, and now I wouldn't go back.

It has it's own satisfaction making excellent ammo, and seeing the groups, especially if you like experimenting and are mechanically inclined.
The specific tailoring to each particular rifle's tolerances can't be matched by the standardized factory specs.

It's good to hear that it took you no time to load ammo that matched the best factory stuff.

From what I've been reading, it seems I should be able to load up .223 for the same or less than the cheap factory stuff, or around 30 to 40 cents per round.

I *really* enjoy shooting the premium factory stuff like the Winchester Supreme ballistic silvertip, and if I can get that same enjoyment without literally burning up $1.25 each time the gun goes bang makes it all the better. (Not to mention the satisfaction of firing my own loads.)

Have others on this forum had similar experience? Have you been able to easily meet or exceed the accuracy of the premium factory stuff with your own loads?

even if you used the most expensive brass (Lapua) at 60 cents each, primers are 2.5-3 cents each, match grade bullets at 15 cents each and about 8 cents on powder thats still only 86 cents per round. Plus you can get 8-12 firings off each brass easily in 223. One of the easiest rounds to load for and you dont have to worry about running out of ammo. When all is said and done I have 8-12 bucks per box of 20 in match grade ammo.

I loaded .223 for an "out of the box" Savage 12 low profile, for years. It would out-shoot most of the custom rifles (some of which cost many,many thousands of dollars) at our local bench shoots! In my experience. Reloading won't "save" you money. (in over all cost) You will just shoot a lot more! 8) :o ;D

Matching factory load quality is not hard to do, and the 223 is a fine cartridge!

matching factory fodder in most rifles could be done in a wet dark cave using bathroom scales, a rock for a hammer, and joints on your finger as a measuring device. But in some guns really like the junk as his seems to. It just hurts my soul to pay $25 for a box of 223. For the price youll pay on ammo for one day at the range you could be set up and making your on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by keeki

matching factory fodder in most rifles could be done in a wet dark cave using bathroom scales, a rock for a hammer, and joints on your finger as a measuring device. But in some guns really like the junk as his seems to. It just hurts my soul to pay $25 for a box of 223. For the price youll pay on ammo for one day at the range you could be set up and making your on.

---

Good advice!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jeffman3

Reloading won't "save" you money. (in over all cost) You will just shoot a lot more! 8) :o ;D

---

Heh ... tha'ts like saying grocery store "buy one get one free" coupons don't save you any money. Yeah, I know I won't save money as in putting it in a bank account, but I'll still be saving money each time I pull the trigger. The fact that I'll just be pulling the trigger a lot more just means I'll be spending the same shooting budget but building my skills a lot faster. (Not to mention having more fun in the same period of time.) :)

if I were you I would go buy a Lee anniversary kit and the dies of your choice. It will have everything you need to start making ammo. Its not as nice as most others but it gets the job done and if you decide reloading is not for you then you wont have a lot invested and if down the road you want something better, just keep the Lee and have 2 presses because its real handy like that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by keeki

if I were you I would go buy a Lee anniversary kit and the dies of your choice. It will have everything you need to start making ammo. Its not as nice as most others but it gets the job done and if you decide reloading is not for you then you wont have a lot invested and if down the road you want something better, just keep the Lee and have 2 presses because its real handy like that.

---

I lucked out in that regard ... I've got a friend that has lots of reloading equipment ... he'll be giving me everything I need to get started, including a .223 die set.

1 IN 9 TWIST 20" BULL BARREL. 52GR SEIRRE HPBT WITH 27.5 GR VARGET 1/2 GROUP AT 100' 3/4" 200'

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ig25

1 IN 9 TWIST 20" BULL BARREL. 52GR SEIRRE HPBT WITH 27.5 GR VARGET 1/2 GROUP AT 100' 3/4" 200'

---

Nice ... how does that compare to the groups you get with that same gun with match grade factory loads?

Also depends on the gun - had a 223 that shot lights out with Winchester white box 45 grain rounds. Could never equal that load with my handloads! But that is very unusual.

As others have said - easy (usually) to better the factory stuff, but don't look at it as a cost savings measure because of the nature of the illness - you will buy the set up, then want a better scale, then a chrony, then a better seating die, then...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eric in NC

As others have said - easy (usually) to better the factory stuff, but don't look at it as a cost savings measure because of the nature of the illness - you will buy the set up, then want a better scale, then a chrony, then a better seating die, then...

---

Illness ... that gave me a chuckle. ;D Shooting is definitely an addiction for me already, and adding reloading to the mix will probably push it over the line into the realm of illness. I've already got my eye on the RCBS chargemaster, and I haven't even loaded a single cartridge yet ... is there a doctor in the house??

I am not a Dr. but I can tell you this I have not shot a factory round in over 20 years.I reload for everything I own and the list keeps growing(damn savages). My 223's both shoot in the .2's using 60gr Sierra's and imr 4895 with a standard cci small primer.Cost about $10 per box of 50.
I can also tell you that only one will not group under .5 (YET). After one more try the barrel will more than likely be re chambered to 308.

+1 what rjtfroggy said. My rifles ,shotguns and pistol have never had a factory round fired in them. I've been loading for more than 40 years.

Since 1965 I don't think I have shot more than 50 rounds of factory rounds other than to qualify at work.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by keeki

if I were you I would go buy a Lee anniversary kit and the dies of your choice. It will have everything you need to start making ammo. Its not as nice as most others but it gets the job done and if you decide reloading is not for you then you wont have a lot invested and if down the road you want something better, just keep the Lee and have 2 presses because its real handy like that.

---

I started with a LEE kit. definitely not the very best, (I recommend a different scale) but I actually prefer LEE Dies over others costing many times there price. (yes,, I have used others) If used properly, They will create ammo to shoot with the best. Why pay more if you don't have to. LEE products are a tremendous value! Don't let the low price scare you into spending more then you have to. ;) If you are shooting seriously in nation matches, then by all means try some high end dies, but I will stick with what works for me. I can out-shoot a $6000 custom rifle, (yes, he is an awesome shot, and loads with custom made dies) with an out of the box savage, and lots of load development. That's enough for me.

I started reloading in 1970 and my first serious accuracy goal was for a Rem 700 HB Varmint rifle. NO factory ammo then or now can beat the loads I worked with 52gr Sieera and Speer bullets. And I'm talking from a USAF Marksmanship Rifle Team bedded stock Rem HB 223- one-hole groups(,257/.244/.275) for 5 shots with loads the rifle liked off sand-bagged fore/aft rests w/ a 24X scope. It now carries a Weaver 6X with a Spider web dot From T K Lee Co. Birmingham. AL and IS NOT FOR SALE! It is all in the load work-up!

You can most assuredly achieve better results that factory ammo. The ammo is made to very conservative size specifications and will 99% not be the best length for your gun. That said, it may be hard to achieve velocities of factory ammo as they blend powders, but most of the time I can find something that equals if not beats it in velocity although I usually shoot slow loads.

I feel like I have to say once a day, "Federal Gold Match or handloads of a buddy of a buddy are not fit to your gun!" when people tell me that there's no way one can load better rounds that premium factory. Some say they've tried and given up. It may be rude, but they are doing it wrong.

Post some target pics once you get one figured out.

remember this when you say "Federal factory Loads"

The only misfire (Dud) I ever had deer hunting, was with a federal 30-06 load 30+ years ago. I have been reloading my own since 1969.

I grew up 20 miles from where RCBS was founded and still resides.

Cheap and accurate Varmint loads are Fiocchi 40 Grain V-Max 50 per box and 1/2MOA out to 200+ yards. 18$ per 50 on sale in the winter off season.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bythebook

Since 1965 I don't think I have shot more than 50 rounds of factory rounds other than to qualify at work.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GaCop

I've been loading for more than 40 years.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rjtfroggy

I am not a Dr. but I can tell you this I have not shot a factory round in over 20 years.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bubbinator

I started reloading in 1970

---

;D Lots of old timers here. I learned reloading from my friend in 1965, when I was a freshman in college. He baptized me in chuck hunting with .222 Rem. It was easy to beat factory then, both in velocity and accuracy. I worshipped Nosler Part, but also found factory Rem and Win adequate. Fed Hydrashock greatly disappointing.
I've read in mags that factory fods have much improved, but here you guys confirm that you're still ahead of factoies. This is very nice to know.

Well, I finally got all my reloading gear together, did lots of reading, and sat down and made up a few rounds. Today I fired them at the range, and I'm pretty happy with the results. I'm using 52 grain SMK, 25.6 grains of Varget, and Federal GM205M primers. I haven't yet measured the chamber of my rifle, so I'm just seating to the OAL listed in the manual. (2.25") I did 4 10 shot groups at 100 yards ... the best one measures 0.87" and the worst measures 1.27". And the wind was pretty gusty. I think that's not too bad for a first try without any fine tuning at all, using the recommended starting load. (Using the Lyman manual.)

Then, a competition shooter at the range suggested I try Nosler ballistic tip bullets. He gave me 6 of his rounds to try, and I put them all in a .45" group. I think I'll try those bullets .... :)

Here are the groups ... the first four are my first handloads, and the last is the group using the Nosler BTs:

http://www.metacraft.com/shooting/first-handloads.html

Anyway, I really enjoyed learning about reloading and putting together this first batch. I'm hooked! Thanks for all the replies here.

If you plan on using 60gr or lighter bullets I highly recommend H322 poowder. I have tried a lot of others and keep coming back to this powder. Above 60gr and I use varget myself.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kslefty

If you plan on using 60gr or lighter bullets I highly recommend H322 poowder. I have tried a lot of others and keep coming back to this powder. Above 60gr and I use varget myself.

---

Okay, great ... thanks. Is there a technical reason for that, or is it just what you've found through experimentation? (I don't mean to sound like I'm questioning the recommendation ... I just love to know the "whys" behind things, as much as possible.)

An older man @ cabela's turned me onto H322 when I started reloading and after numerous tries with other powders I keep coming back to it. I prefer sierra blitz king bullets, H322, and regular CCI primers. This is half the fun, trying different combos. I do think the faster burn rate of H322 makes it shine over varget with light bullets.

Back with another range report after working up some loads ... this time for a new rifle, a Model 12 LRPV:

http://www.metacraft.com/shooting/ra...011-11-09.html

For those that don't care to look through the info, my best group of 5 shots was 0.40". If I drop the worst shot from each group, the best group is 0.29". Looks like the best load I've tried so far in this rifle is 25.0 grains of Varget with a Sierra 52gn HPBT.

Fun stuff ...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kslefty

If you plan on using 60gr or lighter bullets I highly recommend H322 poowder. I have tried a lot of others and keep coming back to this powder. Above 60gr and I use varget myself.

---

Good advice.

52grn Berger FB's seem to work the best in my 9 twist 223 BVSS, One of my best shooting purely factory rifles!

I am going to try it at 300 yds one day!

I would be interested in seeing your favorite loads

Another though on reloading When I plan a hunt I always make sure the rifle or rifles"s I take that factory ammo is available in the event your ammo is lost Etc. I haven't shot factory ammo for 35- years or more ever sinse reloading unlees I get some in a trade and I shoot it up for ther brass. Use to be that reloading saved alot of money but most reloaders would say they reeload for the accuracy you get over factory ammo, But today with components going out of sight accuracy is the reason to reload. Factory ammo has gone a long way in the accuracy department. I on occasion have worked a very accurate load up to find the factory supreme to shoot the same POI but I always sight in my rifles every year to be sure they are still on. Good Luck this Hunting season to everyone and may you get that once in a lifetime trophy. I envey you guys who tromp thru the wood I can no longer do that but I have had my share of hunting. Have a permit to hunt from a car now due to disabilities I have reached a point in life where I can afford it but the body won't co-operate. (Golden Years My A%$) Lou

Another range report with the Model 12 LRPV, this time using H335 powder and 69 grain SMKs:

http://www.metacraft.com/shooting/ra...011-12-02.html

Not too bad I guess. I figure I still have a good deal of experimenting to do before I find the right combination of powder, bullet, and seating depth.