Cleaning the most dirty barrel I have seen?

So, this isn't aftermarket, it's a factory 223 barrel that I bought used, but I didn't want to post in 110 tech for fear of missing out on advice from non-110 users...

I bough a used 223 barrel here and it's one of the dirtiest I have ever seen. I am not getting any copper out of it, but it will NEVER come clean from the black, and I see what almost looks like rust bumps inside the barrel. Those appear to be coming out some as I scrub. I think I have already gone through over 100 patches over the course of 2 weeks. I have been soaking overnight with Shooters Choice until I ran out, now I'm soaking nightly with Hoppes #9. Almost daily I scrub with a nylon brush and a few passes with a tight bronze brush. This releases a ton of black. I put a few more wet patches through and then let it sit over night. I have done this for many many days now, and I do think it's getting somewhat better... mostly towards the chamber end.

I have also tried something a bit different here (since I don't have high hopes for this barrel), I have run a few patches of Flitz metal polish through the barrel. Those come out black as night and smelling of freshly burnt powder. After that, it appears to let loose more black... so I scrub and scrub.

What else can I do? I'm thinking about getting a stainless brush to see if that helps. Is there any chemical that I should try? Any mechanical gadgets or processes? If the answer is to scrub more, then I'll keep at it and maybe put this on an action once it's clean, 6 months from now! I know it will never shoot like a dream, but I just want it as good as I can get it before I mount it to an action.

Thanks for any suggestions!

Hi Dperk one thing I have used is to get some 0000 steel wool and wrap a little piece of it around a brass brush. Then soak it in a cleaning solution like Butches and then make a pass or two thru it. Follow that with a wet patch of Butches and a dry patch or two.

I hope that helps. Gordon

P.S. I have also used some foam spray that is made to clean carbon from inside boat motors. I spay it in the barrel and let it set awhile then run dry patches thru it .

put it on and shoot it,my 300 rum is the same way,had a smith borescope it and he said the barrel looks good and shoot it,so I did and it shoots

I dont think I would use a stainless brush. You might damage the bore.

I would just use wipeout. I have cleaned barrels that have not been cleaned in 5 years or more
and multiple uses of wipeout will clean them.

I wipeout it, let it sit, run a patch through and repeat.
Hit it with brake cleaner at the end and a super light oil patch.

Other than that maybe JB bore paste although I have never used it.
Supposed to be good stuff.

If you ever get it clean and it wont shoot, you could try some tubbs FF bullets.

Of course after all of that you probably could have bought another barrel.

Does it shoot good? If so, why worry?

interesting about steel wool.... I'll keep that as an option if all else fails.

Tammons, did you use accelerator with wipe out? I have used wipe out on it 2 times and let it sit over night. That is what originally removed all the copper that I found in there. Instead of brake cleaner, I used "gun scrubber" but that didn't do anything but degrease it

JB bore paste is an option, but I figured the Flitz polish I used is probably similar and maybe more gentle.

I thought about tubbs bullets also as a last resort.

Gordon, I looked for some carbon cleaner for carbs, but didn't really find any. If you have the product name, let me know. I think Mercury makes something for outboards, but I'm not sure.

Maybe i'll do as viper said and shoot it a few times!

Eric, I have never screwed it on yet. I was just trying to clean it up before I fired it the first time.

One item that creeps up once in awhile....is your brush making the barrel seem dirty? Buddy of mine just about wore out a cleaning rod because he was using a bronze brush with some copper remover. After five ruined brushes (the copper cleaner was eating those brushes up rather nicely), I showed him the barrel was clean after leaving the copper remover in for 30 minutes and pushing a clean dry patch and following up with a plastic brush.

Somebody mentioned one item that works rather well. Shoot the barrel 5 shots and clean the barrel warm.

Spray some carb cleaner in the barrel and let it sit for 30 minutes. Follow by a clean, tight fitting patch, and check the patch.

Buy a chamber plug, fill the barrel up with a good solvent like Shooters choice, and let it set over night. For badly fouled barrels I use a old bronze brush, wrap it in 0000 steel wool and cover it with JB, and scrub the barrel with it.

dperk I use Quicksilver Power Tune and it is made for outboard motors. I bought it for my 120 hp from my Mercury dealer. It looks like the foam carbon removers made for guns and it may be the same thing.

My Ruger M77 in 7mm Rem Mag barrel cleaned exactly as you are describing.
I had shot moly bullets in it for a couple years.
My guess is this barrel did too.
None of my other barrels had that much black crap in them.
And, the moly round count wasn't all that high either, maybe 100.

I ran into this after shooting a sako 7mm mag with winchester ballistic silver tips. That black crap gets in them so bad and is a sonofa***** to clean out.

Just lots of shooters choice and scrubbing is all i can tell you.

I don't think the brush is the issue. I'm mostly using a nylon brush and it still comes out dirty after scrubbing like crazy with the nylon.

Maybe I will plug one end and fill it up with shooters choice. That sounds easy enough on an unmounted barrel. It sounds like the quad 0 steel wool could be an option in the end if it's still dirty. Maybe I'll shoot it once first to see how it behaves down range.

I have read about people using Power Tune cleaner and also some carb cleaner that is made my GM. I may try to add some of that to my cleaning arsenal.

WYcoyote, you bring up something I never though of... maybe this barrel did see moly. I took a picture to show you all what it was and is now. Some of the patches did look more medium grey and not so black... That probalby is moly (I never really used it).

In this picture, the patch on the left is an older one when it was really black. The one on the right is one from tonight.

[img width=600 height=398]http://i437.photobucket.com/albums/qq99/SirJeepenstein/DSC_0067.jpg[/img]

So far the scrubbing is working... it IS better than it was!

Not looking to start a feud here, but IMO nylon brushes are useless and the reason they call stainless gunsmith brushes is that you will need one if you use them. As part of my normal cleaning (real dirty bore after a match or long pratice) I use a little Iosso on a patch wrapped around a brass brush. For what it's worth.

Foaming bore snake? Plug the barrel and let it fill up. I've heard of WWII vintage barrels coming completely clean with a single application.

i don't want to start anything either but you say not to use a stainless brush and then say use steel wool? correct me if i am wrong but steel is steel no matter what form it is in be it a brush or wool.

If it is in that bad of shape just keep using bronze brushes and scrubbing it and the foaming cleaners also work ok if you let them set for a while.


Gary

Kroil and brass brushes.Wipe with clean patches often. Go slow. After you get some shine, switch to Flitz with a tight fitting jag... work from chamber to muzzle only.After it's shiny, clean with Kroil. my 2 cents...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dperk

What else can I do? I'm thinking about getting a stainless brush to see if that helps. Is there any chemical that I should try? Any mechanical gadgets or processes? If the answer is to scrub more, then I'll keep at it and maybe put this on an action once it's clean, 6 months from now! I know it will never shoot like a dream, but I just want it as good as I can get it before I mount it to an action.

Thanks for any suggestions!

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instead of continuing to jam rods and brushes down that barrel (and risk damaging
it by "overcleaning"), if it bothers you so much why don't you borrow/buy/make
an electronic bore cleaner?

A big huge "+1" to what 82 Boy says!

Get yourself a chamber plug (Sinclair's has them), and fill that barrel up to the top with either Shooter's Choice, or Butch's Bore Shine.

I use Butch's. I have done that on a few barrels that were truly horrible, and letting them sit for an hour or so, I've been able to push all that crap out of the barrel with one clean patch on a jag.

I set mine up in my bench vise (rotated to vertical), with soft jaws in the vise, put in the chamber plug (it has an O-ring to keep the solvent from leaking out the bottom), and literally fill the barrel all the way up until it puddles above the crown, and let her sit. This method takes ZERO scrubbing. The chemical reaction of the solvent does all the work. Let it sit for a couple of hours at most. I then pour out the solvent into my shop trash can, remove the chamber plug, and push a single patch through from breach to muzzle end.

If this doesn't get the barrel squeeky, virgin, clean, nothing will, and throw that barrel away, you're wasting your time with it.

When it's done, you will have to "break in" the barrel all over again, because it will be raw steel clean.

Here's the plug:

http://www.sinclairintl.com/.aspx/pi...r_Chamber_Plug

Quote:

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Originally Posted by earl39

i don't want to start anything either but you say not to use a stainless brush and then say use steel wool? correct me if i am wrong but steel is steel no matter what form it is in be it a brush or wool.

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The steel used in steel wool is very soft compared to barrel steel or stainless.

I picked up a chamber plug from Midway... I think that may be the right idea for this barrel.

Thanks for all the ideas! I also got some 0000 steel wool just in case, but I doubt I'll use it. It is really quite soft and you can pull it apart like a cotton ball.

Now I need a bolt head and I can try to shoot this one!

You will spend 2 weeks cleaning this barrel giving yourself gray hair then end up shooting 100-200 rounds through it to settle it back in. As you can tell I am not a real believer in clean barrels shooting the best. ;)

I'm ok with a barrel that is 'settled in' dirty or seasoned... this barrel looks more like it has chunks in it.... At first I though it may have seen some rust, but now I believe it's just spotty carbon build up. The chamber plug should be here on Tuesday (monday being a postal holiday). I bet it will clean right up. If it does need a bunch of rounds to season it again, then that's fine. I had needed a Bolt Head anyway to ever shoot this thing... I guess they are hard to find 2nd hand, so I ordered one from Lisa at SSS yesterday. If I would have had the bolt head when I got the barrel, I wouldn't have bothered cleaning it so much and at least tried it out first.

Thanks again everyone for the replies!

If that back stuff is Molly Dawn dish soap may really help to get it out.
If its carbon GM Top Engine cleaner will get it out.

I've found Hoppe's to be a little weaker than Shooters Choice, but Butch's is stronger. If your rod is coated, like most of the good ones these days, aggressive cleaning even with a bore guide will cause it to flex and slap against the rifling, possibly depositing coating in the bore. Be very careful with any polish or steel wool, since it will remove steel. Dirt may act as a stencil and protect some areas, resulting in an uneven surface. JB paste is excellent for anything, and they also make a polish called Bore Bright, probably like jewelers rouge - same color - for use on a clean bore. It is intended for microscopic tool marks and such and leaves a mirror-like finish. I always follow directions but never use near as many strokes as they recommend. Hint: if you are going to take a rifle to the gun show, run a few patches of Bore Bright and you will probably sell the gun, since most people have never seen as bore so brilliant.