Printable View
I recently bought my first brand new rifle (223 VLP). I done some searching regarding barrel break in and have found mixed opinions. Do any of you more experienced savage shooters have any insight? Anyone "break in" one rifle and just shoot one like normal and notice any difference? If so what was your "break in" procedure? Thanks for any help or advice.
1ShotKing
How do you "break in" a standard factory button rifled barrel, will a bore brush and copper solvent make the button rifled bore below smoother?
Below, the throat.
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o...oat-1-C-RS.jpg
Below two inches from the muzzle.
http://i122.photobucket.com/albums/o...ommuzzle-2.jpg
Watch the video below on a factory barrel and a custom made barrel, the video should answer your question
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hf9zZqn00CA
Shoot your rifle and then use some foam bore cleaner to remove the copper after each trip to the range is the best way to remove the copper in the bottom valleys of the button rifling without undue brushing.
1Shotking to answer your question YES.
What I found on my very non scientific break in was it made no difference in accuracy when all was said and done.
I followed the recommended procedure more than once and then on a few others just shot then cleaned when I got home then did the same a few more times,and basicily these guns perform the same, they clean up the same(when I clean), no different.
I read once that a barrel maker said that the procedure was to get you to shoot your barrel out quicker,hence needing more barrels leading to more sales.Google "barrel break in" you will find it.
I have no strong feelings regarding this issue, but I think you should listen to what this man has to say.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRRahHX9Zkg
Just shoot the thing...
The plan was and is to just shoot it but I didn't see any harm in posing the question since there was no definitive answer. Thanks for the insight.
1ShotKing
I dont think is necessary but I dont see how it will hurt it. Go for it if you feel inclined...
My experience with Savage barrels is that it takes about 75 to 100 rounds down the tube plus a good cleaning with JB bore paste to get the best accuracy. I had a 204 Ruger that went from a 1 3/4 inch gun to 1/2 gun. The accuracy has been pretty constant since then. My advice, just shoot it.
Classic!!Quote:
Originally Posted by rattfink
Wow ! Way to treat your equipment....
I think the pictures show a pretty extreme chatter example. If every barrel started out that way, I don't think any amount of lapping would improve it. If I ever get one like that, it goes straight back to the factory.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigedp51
That's what my model 10 looks like I'm just gonna shoot it out! I got so tired of cleaning it that I quite cleaning the barrel when accuracy drops off I might clean it, it's getting a rebarrel job any way. No sense trying to polish a turd it'll still be brown. If that's a brand new rifle you purchased if it were me like others said I'd be going back! I also asked my gunsmith about lapping compound I'm a neutral stander on it and have used it in extreme instances but this is what he said " when you use lapping compound you elongate the til and chamber of the bore as hand lapped barrels are lapped before they are chambered and finished to length" makes sense.
The point is that it is a manufacturing defect. There is no other way for those artifacts to get there. If I were you, I would send it back to Savage and tell them to replace the barrel or face a product lawsuit. There is no way Savage or anyone else can escape when they sell defective product with systematic characteristics like that. Just don't take no for an answer. If you want to be kind, you could offer to pay a % of the cost of the barrel based on how many rounds you have fired, but no labor costs for the re-barrel.
+1 for westcliffe01's answer savage are usually good to deal with and when I get done with my 10 barrel I'll be sending it to them over 800 rounds and it's still corrugated pipe. Might want to save the pics as many as you can take and get jic it gets nasty
If you are concerned about those chatter marks get that kit of abrasive coated bullets (the name escapes me at the moment) and follow instruction. There have been many posts over time about them and I don't recall anyone saying they damaged a barrel. In fact if memory serves, the comment was that they did not have to use the whole kit of coated slugs to clean up the barrel. Most reported their barrels were easier to clean and accuracy improved.
El Lobo.
There is no way that barrel is going to "clean up". Did you see the size of the chatter marks relative to the barrel lands ? All fire lapping will do is wear out the throat and void his warranty. The barrel needs to go back to Savage without messing with it.
I have read a lot of posts about firelapping and you saying it will wear out the throat is the first I have ever heard that. On what do you base this revelation?
This is interesting about throats-
http://www.lasc.us/bellmFirelappingBarrels.htm
It is well known that fire lapping enlarges the throat disproportionately. And I am sure that firing abrasive loaded bullets will void your warranty, regardless of what manufacturing defect you are trying to fix. Using very fine abrasive to polish the throat after a less than stellar chambering job is one thing, but you are never going to have any impact on a chattered barrel like that in the pictures.
Every gun barrel I have fire-lapped with Tubb Final Finish has shot under 1/2 MOA for 5 shots at 100 yds. (They got bedded, too.) The lapped stainless custom barrels may not need this at first, but every barrel needs some lapping to restore optimal accuracy every 500 or so rounds.
This is a response to the original post, not to the comments about the barrel shown in the pictures.
Westcliffe01,
I don't know who you think you are, but I think you're awesome, haha
You are correct, Fire Lapping is great for billy bob, but is not a good technique, in fact it's a little drastic. In order to properly lap a barrel, a lapping guide, hardened steel rod, two vices and a smeltering set-up to make bore laps out of lead. Fire lapping will help a person polish the lands and grooves, but if there is a defect in the barrel it will make it worse.
The object isn't to make the bore silky its to make the bore the same diameter, or have an even taper down the tube. If you fire lap something with a jacketed bullet, then the pressure behind the bullet will force it to take metal away from all tight spots, AND wide spots in the barrel. Do to the nature of copper jackets and pressure, a jacketed bullet expands and contracts as it passes over different high and low spots. SO again, if you have a barrel with a wide spot or gouge in it, then it will become worse, this will lead to gas pressures escaping around to the front of the projectile and will make the flight wobble. It could shoot 1/2' at 100 but at 500 it could shoot 3feet.
Lead lapping is the best way to lap a bore, but to my dismay in the gunsmithing community it is becoming a lost art. and it is an ART! Lead is a dead metal so once it is squeezed down to a smaller diameter it doesn't enlarge again. So what you're doing each time you pass the lap down the tube is you're taking out the tight spots in the bore, After lapping is completed(about 10-12 hours of work) you should have a bore that is more even down its length, or have a slight taper (with lead cast bullets or rimfires you want a taper so the tightest point is at the muzzle).
now, another thing is this, there was a gent a few years back that did an erosion test. he took two bores and measured them (stainless with carbon material). He then proceeded to fire 16,000 rounds out of each barrel, one barrel he cleaned often and the other he never did. At the end he cleaned both barrels and re measured the lands and grooves, and throat errosion, he came up with the conclusion that a clean bore vs a dirty bore does no damage over a lifetime of shooting, BUT let me say that he never put oil, dirt, snow, water, and all the other crap from the floor board of papa's chevy in the bore. It was in a controlled setting. I think we all know that a good clean firearm is a happy firearm and that cold bore shots are risky. Just thought it was an interesting article to share.