Barrel locknut

Hi all,

I am very new to this forum and I am slowly working my way through the huge amounts of info on this site. All great stuff.
I do have a quick question though. I own a 112 in 25/06 and am looking at replacing the barrel on it. I spoke to one gunsmith about this who rates the savage action quite highly and would do it for me.
He did say something that made me start looking for more info about the barrel locking nut. He said that the lock nut is just a gimmick and would chamber and fit the barrel into the action without the nut.
Has anyone else done this and does anyone else think along the same lines.
Thanks for any replies.
BTW I am in Australia too.
Thank you.

IMHO, the only problem with chambering the barrel "without" the nut? If you want to swap barrels, it has to be headspaces on a lathe. (back to the gunsmith!!)
The advantage of the barrel nut and floating bolt head is you can do it yourself. (if you're so inclined)
Don't like the caliber it's chambered in or want to try something else? Brake the nut loose, swap the pre chambered barrels and bolt head if needed, set the headspace and go shooting. And no waiting till the smith has time.

I often do my Savage barrels nutless. I prefer them that way for aesthetic reasons and for ease of barrel swapping.
Once you have nutless barrels setup for your rifle you can swap them around more quickly and with the exact same headspace each time. With the barrel nut you need to use GO/NO-GO gauges every time you do a swap and I'm convinced that the headspace isn't the same every time.

Both answers so far have good points but my thought is if you want a Remington buy a Remington. The reason for the barrel nut is for ease of replacing your barrel with ones obtained from various places. Buy your buddies barrel this morning and be shooting in 15 minutes, barrel is delivered in evening shoot in the morning all with no gunsmith required.

One thing about barrel nut guns is there is no dout your headspace is dead On not that you can't get a shouldered barrel dead nuts But I have headspaced a lot of Rifles new and old that the headspace was in the Field range ... But never a savage Hope this helops DD

Barrel nuts are a gimmick, just like having to torque your wheel lug nuts.
If ONLY we stayed with the backwards thread so they didn't fall off when driving....

If you don't want to be able to do the work yourself(or without a lathe) then buy any of the non-nut actions out there.
If you want the versatility to be able to do things yourself, get an action with some nuts!!!

Or better yet, get a lathe!

Can't imagine not having a lathe now that I've had one in my basement for 15 years.

You then can have the best of both worlds. Do it yourself ease and nutless aesthetics and headspacing sans gauges. (once your headspace is set initially of course)

Nutless Savage bbl?..... Why make a silk purse into a sows ear? If you'd rather line your gunsmiths pockets w/ cash go nutless. The "gimmick" is that you no longer need his services !

Unless of course you want something other than a generic chamber and in particular a generic throat.

To me a throat cut to my exact desires is the primary reason to go with an aftermarket barrel.

And even though I often do my own throating and chambering I find great value in gunsmiths who are profitable, talented, and knowledgeable. I see them as an asset to the shooting community rather than a detriment.

We've trod this ground before and my opinions on this are my own and only provided as one answer to the question raised by the OP.

I wonder if you can get your tools; action wrench, nut wrench and gauges, as well as your barrel for the cost of what you would pay your smith? Hmmm.

When I was affluent (translation; working) I lusted after a lathe and a Bridgport. Even used, good ones were outside my ability to pay. For the cost of a good lathe (Hardinge) I could own a passel of very expensive rifles. The barrel nut let me build two rifles for cartridges I love but are not in any makers catalog. .35 Whelen and 7mmMauser. Cheaply and not having to resort to machinery. If you really want a nutless rifle by all means build one but as for me I love my nuts. Aestheticaly I think the barrel nut looks manly and sets us apart from the mundane and usual. (translation; Remington, Ruger, Winchester etc.) Although, I do love Mauser actions.

El Lobo

The nut/nutless aesthetics are up to you. Your smith is saying that he can turn a shoulder on a barrel, chamber and headspace it to your gun, and you can then remove/replace it to the same headspace without gauges by simply screwing it on and off. While it will work easily on that action, you may not be able to put it on another action and have acceptable headspace. A barrel with a nut can be swapped between guns and set to each by using go/nogo gauges. Loctiting a nut or pinning it are similar ways of maintaining a certain headspace on a barrel. Once the barrel is headspaced to your gun, there is no further need to be paying the smith, and he may set a barrel up this way for the same cost as turning/threading/chambering a barrel with a nut. He's not necessarily just out to get more money from you. He's offered you a viable option that does not limit you. You can still use other barrels with or without nuts or even have the threads turned out later to put a nut on if you wish.

Personally, I wouldn't have spent a dime more on my old Savage to have a quality smith do anything. Since I can do it myself, Whole new game!
My first bolt action was a 7mm Mauser 98' sporterized. I killed a lot of deer with that one. I do love the Mauser action, such craftsmanship. I will look for another of these one day, and I'll put a nut on it! In fact, knowing what I do now, I'd nut anything.

A nut isn't necessary on a Mauser. Neither is a shoulder in fact.

Mauser barrels screw on until their flat breechface contacts the inner C-ring which is all you need.

So a nut on a Mauser would be superfluous and wouldn't help you swap barrels or headspace.

A gunsmith could've told you this.

:yield::yield::yield:

Stangfish I agree. We have beat this to death. Lets give it a rest. To each his own.

El Lobo

The OP's question was specifically about a shouldered barrel on a Savage. He got his answers.

Leonardo stated he'd put a nut on a Mauser. I pointed out that a Mauser doesn't headspace the way a Savage or for that matter any other rifle does.
Herr Mauser's design requires machine work to set the headspace and a shoulder or a nut is unnecessary on that particular design.
A good gunsmith will cut a shoulder on a Mauser about .002" more after the breech contacts the C-ring (H-ring in some later or cheaper Mausers/clones) and fitting the barrel results in a crush of that .002" so that the shoulder contacts the receiver face. The breechface/C-ring interface is what establishes headspace though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ktm525

He said that the lock nut is just a gimmick and would chamber and fit the barrel into the action without the nut.
Has anyone else done this and does anyone else think along the same lines.
Thanks for any replies.
BTW I am in Australia too.
Thank you.

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Is it hard for you to get the tools neccesary to swap the barrels yourself in Australia? Personally I'd never spend the money on a lathe because I am too cheap...
I also wouldn't pay more for a shouldered barrel vs a non shouldered barrel again because I am cheap...
If I could get a shouldered barrel headspaced for my Savage action for the same or less than buying a pre-fit then I would. Because I'm cheap.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cgeorgemo

Is it hard for you to get the tools neccesary to swap the barrels yourself in Australia? Personally I'd never spend the money on a lathe because I am too cheap...
I also wouldn't pay more for a shouldered barrel vs a non shouldered barrel again because I am cheap...
If I could get a shouldered barrel headspaced for my Savage action for the same or less than buying a pre-fit then I would. Because I'm cheap.

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Thanks for all the replies. I must admit I have never looked into what it would cost or take to get the tools required to swap barrels here, only because it is something that I would not do. It does appear that everything required to do that is a lot cheaper in the US than it is here. That includes the price of dies for different calibres as well. For that reason, once I have made my calibre selection that is what the rifle will stay as. I can certainly see the advantages of barrel swapping but it's just something I wouldn't be bothered with.
Once again thnks very much.

Oooh oooh, one more reply.
It's not like you have done anything permanent. You can have barrels both ways for your action. It is not hard to change, righty tighty lefty loosey type thing.


Jim

Quote:

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Originally Posted by holstil

Oooh oooh, one more reply.
It's not like you have done anything permanent. You can have barrels both ways for your action. It is not hard to change, righty tighty lefty loosey type thing.


Jim

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Yup

Welcome Jim

Unless of course the mauser happens to be pre 98 then nuts away .seems like we all have a deep passion, obsession with mausers last count was over 856 mauser military ,not counting sporters , but i think i mite buy another at this weekends gunshow.
Gary

Nothing like going from a .308 to a 30-06 in less than 5 minutes, or 30-06 to 270, or, or , or

I really don't "get" the nutless benefit (Unless we are talking about my dog.) The way I see it, you still have to screw the barrel down to the receiver, and you would still have to line up some witness marks as it would be easy enough to over\under tighten a barrel. Right now I simply scribe a witness mark on my barrels...and tighten down the nut....and go shoot.

That way I save any gunsmithing fees for re-chambering\re-boring. I'm not really seeing a benefit here.

And with the new smooth nut.....well?????

No indexing required. It's just a little faster easier without the nut (no head spacing needed). I've shot matches with my switch barrel rig just snapping tight by hand. Taking off requires a barrel vice, they get a little tighter after you shoot. I still like the option with the nut.

Jim