Any opinions? Is it worth it for the money? I've seen the vids and read Amazon reviews. They have it for $195 right now.
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Any opinions? Is it worth it for the money? I've seen the vids and read Amazon reviews. They have it for $195 right now.
I received mine back when there was a looooooong line of people waiting for them.
It's an excellent tool. Not only at least 1/4th the price of a Hawkeye you can store any view on the supplied SD card and then transfer it to your PC. No rinky dink adapters for cameras needed, just maneuver the wand into position for the view you want and then press the button to "take" the picture. It could use a "focus" feature but by adjusting lighting level on the display unit and manipulating the wand you get a fine picture.
Warning, if you get one you'll end up spending a lot more time cleaning than you used to. It shows up copper and carbon that you may well have left behind previouisly. Also can show how rough your barrel is and you'll be motivated to do some lapping rather than wasting a few hundred rounds "breaking in" the barrel.
I power mine from a LiIon battery pack that is used to charge cell phones etc. Just plug in the USB connector that would ordinarily be plugged into the wall AC adapter and you can take it to the range. A Cabela's Crossbow Bolt carry case makes a better carry case than the cardboard box it comes in. The foam from the box fits the Bolt case almost perfectly.
The $195 price is well worth it. I got mine for $229 and it took months for it to arrive.
Thanks. I just ordered it.
A couple shots from mine.
Savage railroad track. .................................................. ........................ Shaw SS
http://oi65.tinypic.com/2e6aq2h.jpg http://oi68.tinypic.com/jzcnep.jpg
Remington VSSF 308 - copper ............................................... A buddies pitted "flinchlock"
http://oi64.tinypic.com/301j5ev.jpg http://oi68.tinypic.com/t68dj4.jpg
On the plus side it will tell you a lot. On the downside your good shooting barrels are now junk! :p
Bill
I've got a Lyman BS as well, and the top left and bottom right look identical to the pics I took of my then new FV12's in 204 & 223. Was a bit disappointing but they still shoot very well right of the box. My Anschultz 64 MPR rifle looks totally different, but so is the price line as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by BillPa
I was talking about the "railroad tracks" with one of the shop guys at Benchmark. These are apparently reamer marks left after the bore is reamed and just "ironed into" the grooves when the button is pulled/pushed through the barrel. You'd think that Savage would either sharpen their reamers of at least hone the bore before 'buttoning' the barrel. Would cut down on all the fouling that it takes months of shooting and/or polishing to get rid of.Quote:
Originally Posted by BillPa
This is what happens when factories are "racing to the bottom" in order to get a larger market share by lowering prices. Lower prices mean more short-cuts at the manufacturing level.
I picked one up when they were on sale. Glad my barrel looks like the picks above. Thought for a minute I had a bad barrel. Read somewhere that said don't look inside the barrel if it's shooting good. When you see a production barrel (see pics above), your going to think you have a bad barrel. My 308 shoots awesome. I think it's because of the carbon build up on the rail road tracks inside my barrel. I'm leaving it. Can put 3 in a quarter at 100 yards. When it opens up, will clean it then. It's a great tool though. Well worth the money.
It will be here tomorrow. Interested what my unfired .223 ftr barrel looks like.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frog
Post pictures please. It will be interesting to see any differences, if any.
It not only has been well worth it from answering a number of questions, service is outstanding from Lyman
1. What is the difference in barrels, you can clearly see it.
2. Is your cleaning working or are you fooling yourself by looks down the barrel?
3. Future you will be able to see and track the throat erosion.
Hinty for both: If you don't want to know, don't look!
I dropped mine when the wand was plugged in.
That's a pretty light connection for a shop tool, there are other USB connections out there that are stuffier.
They sent me a new one.
Ok received it and looked at my unfired 30" .223 barrel. All I can say is wow. How this barrel looks is terrible. I compared it to a new browning barrel. Now I know why there are so many aftermarket savage barrels. I did not take pics yet. I'm gonna slug it and see how that goes. So I will shoot it for a while to see what happens. If it's bad I will fire lap it. That don't work it's a fire poker. Should have just built the rifle. Lesson learned. Maybe I'll shoot it and it will be a tack driver, you never know. I give kudos to the boroscope. I never knew the inside of my nose looked like that. Seriously, for the money, it's a great deal. Glad I got it. All the barrels I've looked at 8 or 9 now, new and old, mossberg to rem, win, browning, sfa, the savage barrel is by far the ugly duckling. Wow, I mean by a lot. I see new barrel in my future. We'll see.
Shoot it first, I'm speaking from experience here. My two FV12's are very accurate with factory ammo. Handloads look very promising as well.
Even as ugly as it is, it will shoot very well. The main issue is that it will be a ^*%$$ to clean and accuracy will drop off quicker than with a smoother barrel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Frog
If I were to buy another Savage the very first thing I'd do is "scope it" than Lap it. Lapping is not that hard, it just takes a little time and patience. Fire-Lapping is certainly an option but I prefer just a poured lead lap on the end of a cleaning rod (using a metal patch loop to hold the lap). Much more controllable and thus accurate in the end. That's all that's missing from the Savage barrels that would make them one of the best factory barrels out there.
As for the lapping, condider it a trade. A few hours at the beginning that will allow you to shoot extended periods without cleaning, and when you do clean it will be far easier with less copper and carbon fouling.
Fist and foremost, what it looks like has nothing to do with how it shoots!
Put that in stone. Hammer forged barrels are very nice and smooth, max nix as we used to say. Hammer can shoot, but it takes work to make them shoot good.
What the tools does is tell you how good you are cleaning.
It also tells you how much throat erosion you have
Smoother is easier to clean.
After market barrel can shoo better, but you have to be able to shoot to at least the capability of the barrel and better is a help.
Reloads are not as good as many factory loads now.
Its all a system. One bad part can throw you off and it does not have to be the barrel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frog
I appreciate your responses and advice. I will have to study up on the poured lead lapping. That sounds like the safest option. What do you suggest for barrel break in for something that is or appears to be in pretty machine rough condition? I used a hornady oal. gauge on it today, and pushing the case into the chamber left some serious scratches on the case. I'm pretty dissatisfied with this barrel. Even if it shoots light out but it's only good for a limited number of shots, that may be a pain in the arsenal to stop and clean, not even an option if I happen to be in a match. Of course I haven't been in one yet but that's the goal. We will certainly see. Rc20 - of course it would be nice to know from the get go if it's me shooting or something else that makes a rifle shoot like a shotgun. Be nice to know that the barrel wasn't an issue on a brand new $1200 gun.
Frog you are jumping off a bridge with out checking to see how deep the water is. Just take the gun to the range and fire twenty rounds through it then take it home and clean it removing powder residue and copper, using both patches and bronze brushes. Then repeat, repeat, and then once more, All this while sighting in and getting to know the rifle and becoming a better shot.
When done with this the barrel will clean easier, be "smoother" and with the right loads hopefully developed while doing this it should be a shooter.
Oh one other thing most Savage barrels not all but most shoot better a little dirty some will even go a couple hundred rounds before they need cleaning.
I have owned Savages since 1972 good times to bad and back to good and never got rid of one because I couldn't get it to shoot.
I have yet to find that true. When I bought my 6.5 Creedmoor I also bought a few boxes of 140gr Hornady ELD-M's just to get a feel for the rifle and gain some brass for reloading.Quote:
Originally Posted by RC20
My reloads cut group sizes in half over those from the factory ammo. I will grant you that some factory ammo is better than the handload's produced by some people but factory still has a long way to go before it's as accurate as well crafted hand loads.
Greatest invention since sliced bread. Just don't let it scare you!Quote:
Originally Posted by Frog
After pondering, you all are correct. I did a lot of research prior to buying this gun. The only reason I went with savage is because of all the good reviews and positive feedback I found when I was digging around trying to decide on my next gun. I mean there was a lot of great reviews. I just can't wait for my stock to get here. (See my other post in reloading section about me destroying my savage stock). As far as the boroscope, I would advise anyone on the edge of buying one to get it. I've looked at every barrel I have. I also looked at the inside of brass, some of it was a shock seeing a case that has been fired a lot. You can see the doughnut and stretching and get a better picture of what is going on with your brass. I discovered what appears to be cracks or cracking in the shoulder area that was not seen on the outside shoulder. These were side to side not up and down. I would post pics but I'm working with a kindle fire cause my computer bit it. I ended up retiring a bunch of hornady 6.5 cm brass that had been shot 6 times. I think I need an anealer now. This is a good site, appreciate all the info and feedback.
A bit off target (?) but how does everyone use or set up their BS?? How do you keep the BS rod off the bore/lands, etc., I realize the BS has it's own guide and it works pretty good, but how do you handle the rest of the rod to keep it lined up with the bore. Trying to look at the small view screen and control the BS rod can be a bit challenging at times (to me anyways) :confused:
i haven't found it to be a problem with the wand just floating in the barrel. I manipulate it with the handle end to get the best view and then just "snap" the picture I want.Quote:
Originally Posted by jpx2rk
If you get an assortment of small O-rings of different thickness just put a couple on the want at intervals so as you insert it there will be more and more centering support. Make the ID the same as he wand and the thickness a little less than 1/2 the difference between wand diameter and bore diameter of the barrel. The wand is pretty much "right sized" for any .22 cal barrel.
Larger the bore diameter the bigger the problem with these. The lens almost has to be touching the bore in the direction you are looking to get a good clear view/picture. Makes it difficult to just run down and scan a bore quick and easy like you do a 22cal bore as you have to reposition the whole rod in the bore depending on which direction the lens is pointing, but it can be done.
Thanks for the tip on the O rings. I don't have any big bores, just rimfire, a 204 & 223"s.
$195 on Amazon plus $25 rebate right now from lyman. Of course right after I get mine.