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Hey guys, I know there are other cartridges and calibers that will give me more, but what can I get out of my 7mm08?
Here re is my setup
Savage 12 single feed action
1:9 twist heavy barrel
on a MDT LSS chassis
currently shooting 168VLDs at 2600fps hornady brass and 40.1 gr Varget.
What loading could feasably be safely used to raise the velocity and or extend the range to max for hitting steel?
Im thinking a moly coated bullet maybe?
Open to all info.
I'll follow along since I just finished building a 7-08 myself in a fairly similar set-up. I'm currently working up some loads using Hornady 162gr ELD-Match... slightly lower weight & a bit higher bc. I'm trying out Varget also, as well as IMR4064 since I keep plenty of that on hand for other calibers. Wanted to try out some H4350, but I can't find it in stock anywhere...
Do keep in mind that max velocity/distance isn't always the best bet. I've found over many years that my most accurate rounds are usually in the 60%-80% of max load, and I'd rather give up a little bit of range for that ultimate precision, not to mention the little bit longer barrel life.
Thank you for your input, I want to try to get max velocity and add a barrel tuner brake and see if I can bring a tight group knowing the load is not tuned to the rifle but the fastest available. Hopefully if a tuner brake really works I will have the best of both worlds.
Gotcha... I've never played with one myself. You'll have to do a thread on that... I'd be interested in how it turns out. As far as velocities, from my homework, I'd say you're pretty close to max density... maybe RL17 might get you a bit more.
Was going to recommend trying RL17 also. Although not a 7mm-08, I saw higher speeds with RL17 than H4350 in my 284 Win.
Has anyone used H100V in the 7mm08? What kind of velocities ?
I have a pound of RL17 also.
S3silver
i have a .284 barrel I san screw on this rifle, how much more velocity could I get from the .284 and what kind of pressures will I see?
Pressures ok for a savage short action?
www.hodgdonreloading.com
Or any one of your loading manuals, tell you what max is.
Go over what the manuals tell you, and your are over-pressure. Savage won't say what pressure they test to, or what the cycle life is. So think of it just like any other pressure vessel: at normal pressure it will last X number of firings. When you go over-pressure by X, that will shorten it's life by Y.
There is no single solitary "safe" over-pressure number, without having some specifics and acceptable life cycle reduction talks.
As far as the "max range on steel", everyone gets caught-up in the velocity wars for no reason; shoot better bullets...
As long as you use a bullet that isn't stretched far enough to have a major difference between it's Center of gravity Vs. Center of Pressure; and had a boat tail angle around 9° you are fine. Those typically less "sexy" lower BC bullets that for the description all safely cross trans-sonic. Meaning you can shoot them as far as you are capable of.
Case in point, the 175 SMK in .308 will happily cross Trans-sonic all day long. Sierra was using the military's Doppler to build and prove this, a very very long time ago(Hornady isn't the first to use Doppler radar). I shoot that bullet to a mile fairly regularly. Velocity at impact is around 800 fps, but the bullet is fine.
Berger's struggle with the CG Vs. CP because they are so long.
I am going to recommend you get at least three reloading manuals rather than getting peoples loads off the internet.
This group is safe but all it takes is one data error entry and kaboom
What is the bullet Mfg?
You then cross check all 3, come up with a safe lower load (your Varget on first check looks ok but it is either just over or pushing the edge per Hornady) and then carefully and a tenth or two at a time take it up.
My Two go to manuals are Sierra and Hornady. They are both good load wise and a wide variety of powders. As they both have a wide variety of bullets you can get a close match and have a good idea.
Lymans will give you general pressure (and I mean general as it may not be the exact bullet, just a type) not for R!7, they don't list it.
While I like R-17 a lot, it is not listed in S or H manuals for that cartridge. Not a lot of data on it though H does list it for some cartridges, not this one.
It may work fine but not listed. Usually it means it did not show all that good an accuracy.
These are MAXIMUM charges. Back off at least 10% (they don't say that!)
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloade...5&cartridge=70
darker
thank you , great info, and advice taken.
Do the 7mm class sierras cross transonic as well as the 175SMK? I an using the new TMK in my ar now in load developement. I like the TMK bullets, working on a load for my AR15 too with the TMK77's
RC20
thank you for the info,
BULLET IS THE Berger 180VLD target
I use the Sierra nad hornady manuals as well as the hornady online calculator.
26" bbl
168 VLD
You can get over 2,700 from...
Ramshot hunter
H-414
W-760
RL-17
VV-550
Norma UPR & MRP & 204
For max velocities I recommend Winchester brass because it will handle the pressures better with out loosening the primer pockets.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cartridge : 7 mm-08 Rem.
Bullet : .284, 168, Berger VLD #28401
Useable Case Capaci: 46.513 grain H2O = 3.020 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. : 2.900 inch = 73.66 mm
Barrel Length : 26.0 inch = 660.4 mm
Predicted Data for Indicated Charges of the Following Powders.
Matching Maximum Pressure: 59000 psi, or 406 MPa
or a maximum loading ratio or filling of 107 %
These calculations refer to your specified settings in QuickLOAD 'Cartridge Dimensions' window.
C A U T I O N : any load listed can result in a powder charge that falls below minimum suggested
loads or exceeds maximum suggested loads as presented in current handloading manuals. Understand
that all of the listed powders can be unsuitable for the given combination of cartridge, bullet
and gun. Actual load order can vary, depending upon lot-to-lot powder and component variations.
USE ONLY FOR COMPARISON !
21 loads produced a Loading Ratio below user-defined minimum of 90%. These powders have been skipped.
Powder type Filling/Loading Ratio Charge Charge Vel. Prop.Burnt P max P muzz B_Time
% Grains Gramm fps % psi psi ms
--------------------------------- -----------------------------------------------------------------
Somchem S365 107.0 45.6 2.96 2750 100.0 59000 7587 1.280 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot Hunter 104.3 46.2 2.99 2738 99.5 59000 8171 1.282 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H414 98.4 44.6 2.89 2729 99.1 59000 8134 1.287 ! Near Maximum !
Winchester 760 98.4 44.6 2.89 2729 99.1 59000 8134 1.287 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-17 95.8 43.1 2.79 2725 100.0 59000 7679 1.275 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N550 100.7 44.1 2.86 2720 100.0 59000 7938 1.297 ! Near Maximum !
Norma URP 103.8 44.0 2.85 2720 100.0 59000 7824 1.291 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP19 ~approximation 103.8 44.0 2.85 2719 100.0 59000 7822 1.291 ! Near Maximum !
Norma MRP 107.0 47.9 3.10 2706 98.0 51534 8822 1.341 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP4 ~approximation 106.3 45.6 2.95 2702 97.5 59000 8086 1.284 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA4 106.3 45.6 2.95 2702 97.5 59000 8086 1.284 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 204 102.9 45.6 2.95 2702 97.5 59000 8086 1.284 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2209 107.0 45.6 2.96 2700 97.3 57516 8205 1.289 ! Near Maximum !
Ramshot BigGame 96.6 42.8 2.77 2699 100.0 59000 7514 1.293 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 11 96.8 42.9 2.78 2698 100.0 59000 7504 1.293 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4350 107.0 43.9 2.84 2696 100.0 57186 7772 1.323 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP4 NT ~approximation 103.8 45.2 2.93 2686 98.8 59000 7839 1.297 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-19 107.0 45.9 2.97 2685 97.3 55806 8233 1.310 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4895 93.1 39.9 2.59 2682 100.0 59000 7403 1.306 ! Near Maximum !
Winchester Supreme 780 107.0 48.4 3.13 2679 97.5 59000 7890 1.286 ! Near Maximum !
Alliant Reloder-15 93.9 40.3 2.61 2674 100.0 59000 7379 1.306 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP11 ~approximation 93.9 40.3 2.61 2674 100.0 59000 7379 1.306 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA11 93.9 40.3 2.61 2674 100.0 59000 7379 1.306 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 203B 94.4 40.5 2.62 2672 100.0 59000 7322 1.307 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S070 102.9 43.6 2.83 2669 99.1 59000 7699 1.310 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H380 95.3 41.8 2.71 2668 99.9 59000 7508 1.310 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 203 old 96.0 41.6 2.70 2667 100.0 59000 7223 1.318 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R904 106.9 45.2 2.93 2665 96.4 59000 7817 1.292 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 7828 SSC 107.0 47.1 3.05 2665 94.8 52789 8480 1.331 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4350 105.5 44.3 2.87 2663 98.5 59000 7643 1.295 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4350 103.6 44.2 2.86 2663 98.5 59000 7629 1.295 ! Near Maximum !
Rottweil R903 98.1 41.6 2.70 2661 100.0 59000 7151 1.319 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP14 ~approximation 107.0 45.9 2.97 2659 97.0 54506 8122 1.325 ! Near Maximum !
PB Clermont PCL 516 91.8 41.9 2.72 2659 99.9 59000 7417 1.302 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4831 107.0 43.9 2.85 2658 99.9 55495 7592 1.335 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4320 95.9 40.4 2.62 2656 100.0 59000 7105 1.293 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S355 98.0 41.1 2.66 2654 100.0 59000 7163 1.315 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon H4895 90.5 38.8 2.51 2653 100.0 59000 7128 1.309 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP7 NT ~approximation 97.1 42.0 2.72 2653 99.2 59000 7429 1.287 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2206H 90.9 39.0 2.52 2652 100.0 59000 7174 1.309 ! Near Maximum !
SNPE Vectan SP 9 91.6 40.5 2.63 2649 100.0 59000 7139 1.305 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S065 101.4 42.6 2.76 2647 99.6 59000 7419 1.313 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S385 107.0 46.4 3.01 2645 98.0 54890 7882 1.340 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N560 107.0 46.9 3.04 2641 93.7 49405 8652 1.371
Rottweil R907 100.0 42.1 2.73 2640 98.5 59000 7518 1.311 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4007 SSC 96.9 42.1 2.73 2640 98.5 59000 7513 1.311 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2208 96.2 40.0 2.59 2637 100.0 59000 7126 1.301 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon VARGET 96.5 40.0 2.59 2637 100.0 59000 7126 1.301 ! Near Maximum !
Bofors RP3 NT ~approximation 98.8 42.1 2.73 2635 99.6 59000 7258 1.299 ! Near Maximum !
Somchem S361 105.6 48.2 3.13 2633 95.4 59000 7644 1.305 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2520 90.9 40.2 2.60 2631 100.0 59000 6742 1.325 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex D073.6 90.9 40.2 2.60 2631 100.0 59000 6742 1.325 ! Near Maximum !
ADI AR 2213 107.0 46.4 3.01 2631 94.4 51670 8332 1.346 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 3031 93.4 37.4 2.43 2630 100.0 59000 6567 1.314 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 4064 100.1 40.1 2.60 2629 100.0 59000 6736 1.343 ! Near Maximum !
IMR 4064 97.1 39.3 2.55 2627 100.0 59000 6958 1.307 ! Near Maximum !
Lovex S062 94.9 39.6 2.56 2627 100.0 59000 6851 1.320 ! Near Maximum !
Raufoss RA15 107.0 46.4 3.01 2624 95.9 48695 8431 1.383
Alliant Reloder-22 107.0 46.4 3.01 2624 95.9 48695 8431 1.383
Bofors RP5/NP ~approximation 107.0 46.4 3.01 2624 95.9 48695 8431 1.383
Hodgdon H4831 SC 107.0 46.4 3.01 2620 94.4 54185 7924 1.330 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N150 103.3 41.8 2.71 2615 100.0 59000 6740 1.315 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N540 93.6 40.6 2.63 2614 100.0 59000 6758 1.317 ! Near Maximum !
Hodgdon Hybrid 100V 107.0 42.9 2.78 2610 100.0 53135 7086 1.348 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate MAGPRO 107.0 48.8 3.16 2610 91.4 48073 8584 1.392
Rottweil R902 93.7 38.7 2.51 2607 100.0 59000 6724 1.327 ! Near Maximum !
Norma 202 91.3 38.5 2.49 2607 100.0 59000 6590 1.320 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2495 93.0 37.7 2.44 2601 100.0 59000 6458 1.353 ! Near Maximum !
Accurate 2700 97.9 43.3 2.81 2591 98.3 59000 7062 1.318 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N140 93.4 39.2 2.54 2582 100.0 59000 6339 1.320 ! Near Maximum !
Vihtavuori N135 99.4 38.6 2.50 2574 100.0 59000 6164 1.329 ! Near Maximum !
-------------------------------------------------------------
First column = Powder name
Second = Case fill %
Third = Charge Weight in Grains (gr)
Fourth = Charge Weight in Grams (g)
Fifth = Velocity in FPS
Sixth = % of Powder burned
Seventh = Chamber pressure in PSI
Eighth = Muzzle pressure PSI
Ninth = Barrel Time in Milliseconds (ms)
Reduce and work up accordingly, be safe and have fun !
Good deal, it sounded like you were not, I get worried, I hope never to see the aftermath of a blown up gun again! (not mine)
168 or 180 gr ?
Curious on what that is based on? Winchester does not seem to be anything special these days (interested not being smart)Quote:
For max velocities I recommend Winchester brass because it will handle the pressures better with out loosening the primer pockets.
RP would be one of my choices, Lapua for really going to the limits.
I have both the 168's I am shooting and also then180's that I am switching to now.
Thank you zero333 that's some great information, well appreciated.
Winchester cases often have more volume, lowering presure with a given load.Quote:
Originally Posted by RC20
Yes, just like the LC 7.62 I use for my 260 Rem. have LESS case volume due to the brass being thicker. This increasing pressure given the same amount of powder. However, I use less powder anyway.
i'll be honest I didn't read other people's responses but here's what i'd reccomend based of what i've done/trying with my .308.
first thing i'd try is get the roomiest brass you can find (winchester is it for .308 not sure on 7mm08)
second find the highest bc bullet that your barrel will stabilize and alot of the new vld's have shorter bearing surfaces that will allow more velocity per pressure.
now that you have a long sleek bullet seat that bad boy out till your .010-.020 off the lands (greater case volume)
lastly try some of the newer wonder powders. for .308 I like 2000MR, look at re17 as well but it's temp sensative cfe223 is supposed to be good as well.
there are two bad things to mention going this route, one you'll have to single feed or consider swapping your barrel onto a long action.
two your going to need more elevation to get to targets so a 30moa base or using the reticle will be needed on the big end once your turrets are maxed out.
Have to recheck but I think Hornady , Nossler, Winchester are the lighter brass out there.
It would seem they have more case capacity.
H100v should be similar to H4350, but it's very temp sensitive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Randyc
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Not sure about a SA, but you should be able to achieve ~ 100 fps more than the 7mm-08. The 284 is kind of the in between the 7mm-08 and 7 rem mag and very similar to the 7x57 and 280 rem. I wanted a 7mm-08 for a long time (and still do), but after long hours of research I went with the 284. Here's the spec on mine and ~ velocties I was seeing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Randyc
Savage 111 LA, previously 30-06 (round count unknown, older action with no accutrigger)
26" green mountain barrel, longer throat (3.125" coal with 162 amax) by Jim @ Apache
Winchester brass, neck sized, ~8-9 loadings, still have tight primer pockets, nothing special done to brass, no sorting, just load and shoot.
CCI 200
My loads (remember this is for my rifle. Reduce by at least 10% and work up in yours):
Current load: H4350, 50.6 gr, 162 amax or bthp (both shoot exactly the same with same poi - lucky me), ~ 2850 fps, consistently .5 moa or less, with good days at .25 moa. Most of my groups are done at 200 + meters, meaning at 100 yards, they are literally one hole groups. Bolt lift fine, slightly flat primers, but it shoots so well I stuck with it. 800+ rounds with no issues with action or brass.
H4831, 56.5gr, 162gr eld-m, half moa at 200 meters. Still trying to dial this load in as H4350 is so hard to find right now. Haven't shot this over the chrono, but should be about 2850 fps (that's what I recall from previous load workup when I first built the rifle).
RL17, 53.5gr, 162 gr amax/ bthp, was getting ~ 2950 fps from previous load work up. Bolt lift ok, brass ok, slightly flat primer. Shot .75 - 1 moa, but didn't try to fine tune it. Found it to be a little touchy in my rifle when doing load workup. Fast shooting powder though. May have to re-visit this powder when my H stock runs dry. From my limited use of this powder, I have seen a good 50-100 fps increase over H4350 and H4831. Also noticed it is more sensitive to temp changes.
Sorry for the long winded post, but hope you found it useful. As always with reloading start low and work up carefully.
I use Winchester and Lapua brass in 243win 7mm08 and 308win. And the Winchester brass takes max loads with stride while the Lapua brass starts to loosed the primer pockets after a few firings and shows signs of pressure earlier.Quote:
Originally Posted by RC20
For example. Worked up a load with 308 Lapua brass and 155gr Scenars.
First and second firing I got 2,990 fps with 47.2gr Varget and 1/2moa, and 48.2 gr had the slightest sign of heavier bolt lift during load work up on first firing with virgin brass.
After the 2nd firing the primer pockets loosened a bunch but still good to hold a primer well.
Annealed after 3rd firing.
At 4th firing the 47.2gr load had the odd harder bolt lift, so I reduced load down to the next node at 45.2gr. @ 2,885 fps
Annealed after 6th firing.
At 8th firing I had to scrap a few pieces of brass due to loose primer pockets, even tho I reduced the load by 2gr at 5th firing.
On the other hand, I have 300 pcs of Winchester 308win brass that's on it's 26'th firing and have not scrapped a single piece (anneal every 5 reloads). And during all load workup I never come across any signs of pressure, and I always work up a bit over max what's listed in Manuals. One of the most accurate loads was with 190 SMK @ 2,720 fps, 24" bbl.
For fast and flat you can drop bullet weight. Factory Barnes Vortx 7-08 are 120gr and fly at over 3000fps.