MOA groups out of my savage axis?

I don't have much time behind this gun and I'm far from an expert shot. So far I've tried Rem Cor Locket, Hornaday American, and Wichester Ballistic tips. My best 3 shot 100 yard group came from the Wichesters which was about 1.5" off sand bags. Called Savage for recommendations and they suggested Federal ballistic tips or Nosler Accubonds. I realize a 1.5" is a decent group. I'm looking for input on if I should be happy with this group, is better grouping potential there? If so, what ammunition have you guys had good luck with? I'm a hunter only but would like long range accuracy. Gun is a Savage Axis xp 270 with accutrigger. Any input or suggestions is appreciated.

I know you're only looking for advice on factory ammo, but 'm gonna say it anyhow. :)

All of my Savages shoot at or better than .5 inches at 100 yards with hand loads. I have never tried any factory ammo in any of them, but, honestly, it's hard for me to not recommend you try getting started in hand loading. It's a lot of fun and very addictive. :)

Maybe others here can suggest good factory ammunition.

Good luck with it.

To my knowledge, there's not a lot of match grade ammo for a 270, but I'm just going off what I've heard... My axis 308 shot sub moa with Federal Gold Medal Match with no issues.

I have never been able to get less than 1" groups out of factory ammo, but I have never worked with an Axis that would not give 1.5". Yours is about average.

You want long range accuracy?

Do you realize that 1.5" groups at 100 equals 7.5 inch groups at 500 yards?

That is deer killing accuracy farther away than one can identify if the animal is a buck or doe without optics.

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Originally Posted by Mortblanc

You want long range accuracy?

Do you realize that 1.5" groups at 100 equals 7 inch groups at 500 yards?

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Your math is not only incorrect, but so is your expectations. I you can't hold any better than 1.5" @ 100, realistically you'll probably never hit paper @500 yds.

A standard issue M16 off the rack from the armory is likely a 2-3MOA gun at best. I still qual expert to 500yds every year and that's shooting all unsupported positions. Just means you won't be able to shoot tiny targets consistently at that range!

However, from a bolt gun 1.5" is not acceptable for me. That's why I rebuild all my rifles to my specs and started reloading.

You can't expect to throw out $200-$300, pick up a box of ammo off the shelf, and have "long range" accuracy from a rifle that's designed to be a beater first hunting rifle for the average Joe looking to shoot maybe 200yds at the most. I know, I completely rebuilt an Axis to what I wanted and in the end after a little over a year I started building on higher end platforms.

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Originally Posted by sharpshooter

Your math is not only incorrect, but so is your expectations. I you can't hold any better than 1.5" @ 100, realistically you'll probably never hit paper @500 yds.

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+1,2, and 3. I'd be shocked if it shot that well at 500 yds.
As always with factory ammo or handloads, it becomes a process of elimination to find a bullet/load that a given rifle likes. That being said, I've had very good luck with Nosler ballistic tips and Accubonds in my handloads. A bonus is that they shoot to the same point of impact in my rifle. I believe that the only difference is that the Accubond is bonded core construction and the BT is not. And the price. But that's pure speculation.
ETA: this is my experience with my handloads. Do not expect Federal factory ammo and Winchester factory ammo to shoot to the same point, even if they're using the same bullet. Too many other variables at play there.

Ok, thanks guys

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Originally Posted by sharpshooter

Your math is not only incorrect, but so is your expectations. I you can't hold any better than 1.5" @ 100, realistically you'll probably never hit paper @500 yds.

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His math and expectations are both correct, you are the one that is incorrect.

If a 1.5" group at 100yds is due to a good amount of shooter error as well as a rifle that doesn't shoot great then all he has is numbers and you will not likely see the exact math. Definitely not consistently!

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Originally Posted by hootntexas

His math and expectations are both correct, you are the one that is incorrect.

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Evidently you need a math lesson too. 1.5 x 5 =7.5 If you haven't mastered short range, long range doesn't get easier.

Oh geez lets not bash guys...

What they are trying to say is 1.5" groups at 100 yrds can mean the bullet isnt stabilizing in the barrel. The further you get the worst it could be.

I dont remember from your first post, what do you have for a scope? Bases? What do your groups look like.

There are many things you can do to improve the accuracy of your rifle.
The axis has a notoriously flimsy stick. Resting off bags makes bad groups sometimes with this flimsy stock.

I would suggest a new stock first and foremost.
Handloading would help a ton as well.

If you cant afford a new stock then look up on here how to stiffen up your factory stock.

It still may be the ammo but start with the start.
Solid stock, bedding quality bases and rings with a good scope.

Cheap out too much on anything and it could cost you

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Originally Posted by sharpshooter

Evidently you need a math lesson too. 1.5 x 5 =7.5 If you haven't mastered short range, long range doesn't get easier.

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Go back and read post #4. He says 7.5.

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Originally Posted by hootntexas

Go back and read post #4. He says 7.5.

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That's because he corrected his own math after Sharp pointed out his mistake. The thing is, precision matters when shooting at 500 yards, and 1.5MOA is NOT sufficient at that distance. Wind, temp, altitude and other conditions as well as adrenaline all affect shot placement. When adding those factors into the equation, the odds are stacked against ya. It's not a big deal, maybe, at 200 yards, but, beyond that, no one shooting 1.5 MOA under ideal conditions should even attempt a shot on a living animal he has any respect of or consideration for.

Having said that, as limige is saying, Yes, there is potential for much better accuracy than what the OP is getting so far. THat's not to say, "Throw in the towel", by any means. It means keep searching for ammo the rifle likes and improvements to the rig. He'll get there. Savages are shooters! :)

Geez, back in the 70's & 80's finding a rifle to shoot an inch was really good, even for a custom built rifle. 1.5" to 1.75 " was a pretty normal good shooter for a store bought rifle, any make. Lots of coyotes even prairie dogs were shot at 400 to 600 with rifles like that. All the new very inexpensive rifles with the Axis being one of the best shoot better than an inch now. A 788 was a shooter in those days but they were an inch gun, on a good day .75. These are the good times for really great shooting rifles for low $!

I have a Weaver Kaspa and weaver mounts on my Axis. Came as a package deal. I fully intend on adding a Leupold Vs2 when I have the money. I thought about a Boyd stock as well but I've read reports of no increased accuracy. I bought about 4 different boxes of amo and 1.5" was the best I could do. I then bout some Federal ballistic tips and Nosler accubonds (by Savage's recommendations) but haven't tested them yet. My groups always had 2 shots within a 1/2" then 1 flier to open it up to 1.5-1.75". Maybe it was the barrel heating up? I'm not all that worried about making 1 MOA but I would like the ability to shoot an animal out to 300 yards and possibly a bit further if the shot presents it self. I was using a 3x9 and to be honest, even at 100 yards the reticle covers the entire bullseye making it difficulty to see/aim at the center of the center (if that makes sense).

Well, yes, some of my sprting rifles open up after 2 shots, for sure. Even my Browning '06. (It's the worst of the bunch). The Kaspa scope you have there may not be capable of anything better, but it is likely good enough for now. Still, I suspect the mounts are bad. These are the worst pieces of junk ever put on a rifle. I wold first recommend replacing the mounts and the rings with a more stable and sturdy setup like maybe DNZ game reaper. I am recommending those b/c they are reliable, one piece, the rings are pre-aligned, and run about $45. As cheap as I'd want to go if it were me. And almost idiot-proof for mounting. :)

You also might look at your rest. Use sandbags if available. If not avail, make some. :) Whatever you do, don't test accuracy by resting any part of the rifle on a hard surface. In fact, always avoid shooting off of a hard surface. If your groups don't improve, seriously consider a Boyd's. They won't make a 1/2 MOA Axis shoot 1/4 MOA, but they most definitely can make a 1.75 MOA Axis shoot 1 MOA. No rifle can be shot well by anyone if the scope is lose, the mounts are poor quality, the action is loose in the stock and/or binding in the stock or the stock is flexing when firing. ALL of the above could be happening. Little things, but they add up and sometimes any ONE of these can cause sever accuracy problems, and I would say you're having SEVERE accuracy problems. Fortunately, it can be fixed rather easily, I would bet my life on it. Good Luck. Keep us posted.

My Remington 788 22-250 would shoot a ten shot group you could cover with a quarter at 100 yrds with factory Winchester 55 gr psp.

Shooters are shooters. 350 yrds was my longest kill on chucks with factory ammo

Ridge, you are getting into dangerous territory here man. This is how the craze all starts! A year from now that thing will be tricked out and you'll be reloading. Someone said earlier 1.5" is acceptable out of the given platform and I tend to agree with them. The reason I say that is not because 1.5" is acceptable for long range shooting but because that package rifle was designed to be someone's first cheap deer rifle and that level of accuracy was considered good if not great from a mass produced gun not so long ago. Someone else also mentioned that above.

You want to start squeezing more accuracy out of the rifle, you'll end up replacing the scope and bases certainly. The fact that the reticle covers the bull could alone be the cause for the larger groupings as it can lead to some error as to where the crosshairs are on the target when the trigger breaks. Once that's done you'll end up replacing the factory tupperware stock with the Boyd's you mentioned and then you'll have it bedded or do it yourself (fun inexpensive project) to see what more you can squeeze out of it.

Trust me, there's plenty of room to go farther off the deep end like the rest of us. Chassis systems, DBM, wondering if that $300 bipod will make a difference, further scope/ring upgrades, the mad science of precision reloading etc. This is just the beginning....

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Originally Posted by badmutha6

Ridge, you are getting into dangerous territory here man. This is how the craze all starts! A year from now that thing will be tricked out and you'll be reloading. Someone said earlier 1.5" is acceptable out of the given platform and I tend to agree with them. The reason I say that is not because 1.5" is acceptable for long range shooting but because that package rifle was designed to be someone's first cheap deer rifle and that level of accuracy was considered good if not great from a mass produced gun not so long ago. Someone else also mentioned that above.

You want to start squeezing more accuracy out of the rifle, you'll end up replacing the scope and bases certainly. The fact that the reticle covers the bull could alone be the cause for the larger groupings as it can lead to some error as to where the crosshairs are on the target when the trigger breaks. Once that's done you'll end up replacing the factory tupperware stock with the Boyd's you mentioned and then you'll have it bedded or do it yourself (fun inexpensive project) to see what more you can squeeze out of it.

Trust me, there's plenty of room to go farther off the deep end like the rest of us. Chassis systems, DBM, wondering if that $300 bipod will make a difference, further scope/ring upgrades, the mad science of precision reloading etc. This is just the beginning....

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Yes I can already feel the crazy starting. Thanks for the advice guys. I'm a bow guy and have a lot to learn about this stuff. I'll start by upgrading the scope and bases.

I've gotten great accuracy out of a number of inexpensive rifle over the years.

The key is to focus on the bullet. Match bullets are best, followed by ballistic tips.

Getting MOA from factory ammo in a cheap rifle is a bigger challenge, especially in .270 where there are not many match bullets available.

With a match bullet or ballistic tip in a hand load, usually tweaking the powder charge in 1 grain increments will produce an MOA load.

If it doesn't, take the most accurate powder charge and tweak the OAL in 0.050" increments.

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Originally Posted by gumbo333

Geez, back in the 70's & 80's finding a rifle to shoot an inch was really good, even for a custom built rifle. 1.5" to 1.75 " was a pretty normal good shooter for a store bought rifle, any make. Lots of coyotes even prairie dogs were shot at 400 to 600 with rifles like that. All the new very inexpensive rifles with the Axis being one of the best shoot better than an inch now. A 788 was a shooter in those days but they were an inch gun, on a good day .75. These are the good times for really great shooting rifles for low $!

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That was before the internet where everyone is a scout sniper and can shoot 3 inch groups at 500yds with a Mosin Nagant...

Ridgerunner7 if I may suggest working on your trigger, if you haven't, as a lite clean breaking trigger will reduce groups. If you are shooting off sandbags you are going to have interference from the barrel touching the stock, as this is well known by all Axis owners. Changing the stock with a Boyds will help. ..
Cheers

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Originally Posted by foxx

I know you're only looking for advice on factory ammo, but 'm gonna say it anyhow. :)

All of my Savages shoot at or better than .5 inches at 100 yards with hand loads. I have never tried any factory ammo in any of them, but, honestly, it's hard for me to not recommend you try getting started in hand loading. It's a lot of fun and very addictive. :)

Maybe others here can suggest good factory ammunition.

Good luck with it.

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+1, hand loads are the way to go.

I could not get acceptable accuracy in my 270 with any 130 ammo, factory or hand loaded. Found some Federal 150 gr round nose real cheap, so tried those. Easily 1" for 5 shots at 100 yds. Killed my cow elk with it. Went back and bought as much as I could.