Caliber 260 or 6.5 Creedmore?

Printable View

03-25-2014, 09:25 AM
justeric

Caliber 260 or 6.5 Creedmore?

I need help deciding if I should switch my Savage 10 FCP-K barrel over to a 260 or to a 6.5 Creedmore. I will be using the gun in long range, tactical matches out to 1200 yards. I want to magazine feed the rounds. I was told that the longer 260 bullets, the ones with the best BC, cannot be magazine fed since they are too long. So I guess the question is, will I get better long distance accuracy out of the 260 or the 6.5 Creedmore bullets that I can magazine feed?

I think I will go with a 26 inch SS barrel with a 1:8 twist for the Creedmore. Not sure about the 260 barrel specs yet.

Thanks,
Eric
03-25-2014, 09:46 AM
scope eye

If you are entertaining a 260 go they AI route, 1200 yards is a long way and that extra 200 or so fps extra, really comes in handy.

Dean
03-25-2014, 09:48 AM
airdale

After a bunch of research I chose the Creedmoor. There is a forum dedicated to the round, you might want to check it out.

http://www.65creedmoor.com/index.php
03-25-2014, 10:03 AM
foxx

Quote:

Originally Posted by scope eye

If you are entertaining a 260 go they AI route, 1200 yards is a long way and that extra 200 or so fps extra, really comes in handy.

Dean

That, and for a whole lot of other reasons I think an AI is better than parent version.
03-25-2014, 10:09 AM
stomp442

I agree with this as well. I love my ackleys and the 260 is probably my favorite. 6.5-284 performance with less powder and recoil what's not to love.
03-25-2014, 10:09 AM
foxx

Quote:

Originally Posted by airdale

After a bunch of research I chose the Creedmoor. There is a forum dedicated to the round, you might want to check it out.

http://www.65creedmoor.com/index.php

I would probably do the same if I was putting it on a short action. L/A I'd go 260AI, but I say that 'cuz I have one and I love it. ( You can load longer with the L/A )
03-25-2014, 10:52 AM
justeric

The 260 AI sounds interesting. My concerns are, barrel longevity and magazine feeding 260 AI and fire forming brass. I'll bet the 260 AI eats up barrels between 1k and 2k rounds which is a lot quicker than the Credmoor. Magazine feeding a 260 AI will probably limit my bullet size (130's?). Don't you have to fire form the AI brass? I guess that's not a big deal.

On the positive, I'll bet that extra fps would be nice when shooting at to 1000+ !!!

What do you load your 260 AI improved with? How much powder and what pills?

Thanks for your help,
Eric
03-25-2014, 11:05 AM
foxx

With a McGowen 26" varmint barrel, I had .25 to .333 inch groups at 100 with 140 Hornady Match bullets and H4350 powder. I am still working on Amax 140's. They are 'spose to be better yet.

Those will feed fine with the short action mag. If you want em much longer, you might need the L/A and its mag. Won't matter if you single-load, though. A nice option for single loading is SSS single load thing-a-ma-jiggy some people call the "Fred Sled". But you don't NEED it, just put a cartridge on top of the mag lips and it should go.

I do not know how the two compare in barrel life. Won't know about my own for a while, either. :)

Fire forming is nothing. Just load 260's rather hot and shoot them. They hit close to where they will once fire-formed and you've refined the load. In the long run you will save on brass (longer life) and you will find there's no stretch, so there's no need to trim. I am using Lee Collet Neck Sizing dies, and I don't need to lube, either. It's not perfect, but neither am I. Some day I may graduate to better dies, but I doubt it. :)

Honestly, I think every 260 should be AI. Maybe everything else, for that matter. But I really don't know about others.
03-25-2014, 11:15 AM
justeric

Forgive me for being a knuckle head but what is this L/A thing?

AI cases have longer life. That is a positive.

Do the AI steeper shoulders cause problems loading from the mag? I would think the steeper shoulder would get caught on the barrel more when loading. Do those 140's shoot well out to 1000+ yards.

Thanks,
Eric
03-25-2014, 11:23 AM
foxx

Quote:

Originally Posted by justeric

Forgive me for being a knuckle head but what is this L/A thing?

AI cases have longer life. That is a positive.

Do the AI steeper shoulders cause problems loading from the mag? I would think the steeper shoulder would get caught on the barrel more when loading. Do those 140's shoot well out to 1000+ yards.

Thanks,
Eric

Sorry, L/A = long action (allows for longer bullets and/or longer seating)

I have not shot mine beyond 100 yds yet. Nowhere around here to do so.

Check this out: oops wrong one. hold on.

Can't find what I was looking for, but there's a lot of good articles on 260AI and most of them were written before Lapua was offering 260. Now that they do, it's easier than ever to make 260AI.
03-25-2014, 11:49 AM
scope eye

You can fireform in the field, and it's not the extra 5gr of powder capacity, that is going to make or break the barrel throat, and as far as feeding does it feed as well as a 30 degree shoulder no, but how fast do you need to cycle a round at 1200 yards, as far as loads go 45gr to 46gr of RL17 with 140s, and 50gr RL19 with the 140s, will put you over the 3000 fps mark, it's a little high on the pressure side but the AI can handle it better, than the standard chamber.

Dean
03-25-2014, 12:40 PM
chukarmandoo

Either one is a good choice. For the tactical application both can be run out of a short action. One thing you need to realize is Savage magazines can run 3.00". In my 260 my COAL is 2.92 with the berger VLD 140's. If the throat was longer I could get more. I have a reamer cut to a 260 improved 30* that has a longer throat and will still be able to 140's out of a mag feed short action. Creedmoor brass seams to be easier to get right now. Remington brass for the 260 is almost impossible to get. On a side note the 6's are hard to beat in the tactical world. Also something to note is while the 260 AI'ed is a excellent round the fire-forming aspect only uses up barrel life and components which are expensive and hard to come by. Remember if you shoot precision tactical you will need at least 200+ rounds.
03-25-2014, 01:34 PM
stomp442

I have a 260 ackley that I built for a local match once a month. I shoot and practice with it constantly. I have well over 1000 rounds down the pipe in fact my records show closer to 1200 and accuracy has yet to fall off. My throat has only grown about 004" since I built it. The rifle still holds 2-2.5" groups at 600 yards. This has been by far my most accurate and consistent rifle. I don't push mine hard, I found a great accuracy node at 2950fps with 140 bergers and 43.5gr of H4350.

Because of my success I have helped a couple other shooters build a 260ai. They have all been on short action savages and there has been no problem fitting in the mag box with 140 class bullets. Each build I have helped with all preferred H4350 powder and each barrel regardless of make seems to have a sweet spot between 2940-2960fps.
03-25-2014, 03:56 PM
justeric

I decided to go with the 6.5 Creadmoor from NSS. Thanks for everyone's input! More questions to come :)

Eric
03-25-2014, 04:07 PM
foxx

Good luck. They're all good!

But 260AI is better than 260.

:)
03-25-2014, 04:31 PM
justeric

Thanks again for your help and from everything I read, the 206 AI is better than the 260. It's hard to decide, 6.5 Creedmoor or 260. I figured its best to just make a choice, right or wrong. It sounds like the choice is between Steak or Lobster. Both are great.

Thanks!
Eric
03-25-2014, 05:12 PM
foxx

Right.

There's no right or wrong between those two.

Just wanted to be sure you considered 260AI vs. the Creedmore, as opposed to 260 vs. Creedmore.

:)
03-26-2014, 01:37 AM
limige

Hmm barrel burner opposed to long barrel life and great shooter. Fps between the two ain't squat. 65creedmoor and don't look back
03-26-2014, 05:19 AM
scope eye

I have been hearing this term as long as I can remember and I have always wanted to know, but no one has yet to answer me, what constitutes being a barrel burner, what is the minimum number of shots from a rife, before accuracy starts to go south to be deemed, a "barrel burner" and how did one come to this arbitrary number, Inquiring minds want to know.

Thanks Dean
03-26-2014, 11:05 AM
the Ranger

it's a meaningless term thrown about by those advocating for their own poor choice in ballisticly inferior cartridges.

Long Live The .264Win mag!
03-26-2014, 11:16 AM
scope eye

Quote:

Originally Posted by the Ranger

it's a meaningless term thrown about by those advocating for their own poor choice in ballisticly inferior cartridges.

Long Live The .264Win mag!

That's an awesome responds, I'm so stealing that,

Dean
03-26-2014, 11:48 AM
bflee

I have the Creedmoor and I am happy. I have never shot the 260 or 260AI or the 264. I do know I can hit 8" steel consistently at 600 yards with no problem. I only missed two out of thirty in an almost ten MPH wind. I am sure you can do the same with the others also.
I have taken four dogs and a crow with mine since Christmas. It is very effective at the range and in the field, as long as you are not carrying it too far! I keep hearing about the brass but I have shot 200 rounds out of 2-20 round boxes of hornady. Thats six firings out of each with no pressure signs. I dont know what their issue is.
03-26-2014, 08:52 PM
limige

Quote:

Originally Posted by scope eye

I have been hearing this term as long as I can remember and I have always wanted to know, but no one has yet to answer me, what constitutes being a barrel burner, what is the minimum number of shots from a rife, before accuracy starts to go south to be deemed, a "barrel burner" and how did one come to this arbitrary number, Inquiring minds want to know.

Thanks Dean

Well smartbutt. ..

When cartridge A gets twice the life of cartridge B and is the same caliber with similar performance then cartridge B is dubbed a barrel burner. Obviously there's no set number because higher performance calibers will burn out quicker than the close range low velocity type rounds. For most people this is a no brainer but certain stubborn types stick with the same thing that's been used for the last millennia disregarding the better engineering of the newer cartridge. Seeing how brass life and barrel life is increased as well as the efficiency of powder burn to velocity but hey I guess that's why cartridge B has been around for a millennia right?!

Especially if the UN uses it... then it must be good lol.
03-27-2014, 06:02 AM
*tim*

Has anyone read up on the 26 nosler cartridge?
03-27-2014, 10:26 AM
Maztech89

Quote:

Originally Posted by *tim*

Has anyone read up on the 26 nosler cartridge?

Yea there is a fair amount of threads on it here. Seems to be guys that can't wait to have one and guys that have zero interest, not a lot of in between I'd say. I'm of the zero interest crowd. If I want to feed a bunch of powder in a case and deal with noise and recoil (inevitable with a case that size) I'll shoot my 300wsm. It's not the same ballistics I know but it's the way I look at it.