Benchmark goes Nitride. Carrying new match bullet

Caliber Inches: .243
Weight, grains: 117.0
Core Density, lb/ci-in: 0.4097
Core Weight, grains: 83.0
Jacket Density, lb/ci-in: 0.32
Jacket weight, lb/ci-in: 34.0
Ogive Radius, calibers: 13.0
Meplat Diameter, inches: 0.07
BC (static): 0.6502

I received a call today from Benchmark regarding an upcoming moose hunt. I learned during the call that they have started offering Nitriding to their customers.
Not only that, they are driving across the border into Canada and building up a supply of Matrix bullets. http://matrixballistics.com/.243-cal...e-bulltes.html

Some of the guys are shooting these bullets and they will flatout bughole. Actual B.C. shooting tests have been conducted and the B.C. are right on what is advertised. They shoot best .010-.020 off the lands! Price looks quite good for a precision bullet.

I was advised that they are more interested at this time in the small caliber bullets and are a bit enemic in their selection of 338 and larger diameter bullets. They recommend Cutting Edge bullets for the larger calibers.

Just information

Neal

I'm interested in the 107g with a BC of .595. This is way above everyone else in that weight excluding the JLKs. That would be awesome it the actual G1 is as advertised.

Quote:

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.277 caliber VLD hunting bullets
top of page
.277 calibre 165GR VLD rifle bullet Caliber Inches: .277
Weight, grains: 165.0
Core Density, lb/ci-in: 0.4097
Core Weight, grains: 118.3
Jacket Density, lb/ci-in: 0.32
Jacket weight, lb/ci-in: 46.7
Ogive Radius, calibers: 13.0
Meplat Diameter, inches: 0.06
BC (static): 0.7381

.277 165GR VLD
$47/100 PCS




.277-cailbre-175GR-VLD-rifle-bullet Caliber Inches: .277
Weight, grains: 175.0
Core Density, lb/ci-in: 0.4097
Core Weight, grains: 126.3
Jacket Density, lb/ci-in: 0.32
Jacket weight, lb/ci-in: 48.7
Ogive Radius, calibers: 13.0
Meplat Diameter, inches: 0.06
BC (static): 0.7828

.277 175GR VLD
$48/100 PCS

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A source for high BC .277 bullets!?

I just called Benchmark today and my 6.5-284 Norma Savage pre-fit barrel was done and they were just about to package and ship it, I hit them up about nitriding it, $100. and one week.
Perfect timing, thanks Neal.

$100 extra for nitriding? Thats a bit higher than I've seen from other sources.

I will enjoy having and sharing others velocities and load data! A bit lonely out there currently. Check with Chris @ Benchmark and how he likes the Nitride on his 280AI. Think he mentioned something about 2800fps and that 190 gr Matrix bullet. What he did say several times was the accuracy.

I did order a box of a hundred 6.5 high BC bullets and a box of those .308 750BC bullets to try with my 300RUM. Chris advised me they ( Matrix)are in the test stage of a higher BC 6.5 bullet and it or they are suppose to be out this spring.

We had a good badgering phone call this afternoon when I teased the owner of Matrix about an .800BC 270 bullet when no one was competing with a 270. In looking at some of their stuff a bit closer. The hunting bullets are the one's with higher BC if I remember correctly. Anyway I was assured the 6.5 high BC bullets will be here shortly. If we have nearly .800bc for a 270 bullet then I wonder what is coming for that 6.5.

I am working hard putting as many rounds down the Nitrided tube of my 6.5 WSM. Will be a good test with those new 6.5 Matrix bullets to see how well they shoot from a barrel that should have over 500 rounds through it by May.

Neal

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Originally Posted by geargrinder

$100 extra for nitriding? Thats a bit higher than I've seen from other sources.

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Well? How much more? (shipped)

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Originally Posted by 358Hammer

Check with Chris @ Benchmark and how he likes the Nitride on his 280AI. Think he mentioned something about 2800fps and that 190 gr Matrix bullet. What he did say several times was the accuracy.

Neal

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He told me .3 MOA. And yes, 2800 something fps. Wow.

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Originally Posted by WYcoyote

Quote:

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Originally Posted by geargrinder

$100 extra for nitriding? Thats a bit higher than I've seen from other sources.

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Well? How much more? (shipped)

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$40 more.

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubb...66#Post2072066

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubb...66#Post2072066


+ shipping it looks like, probably 2 ways. and have to coordinate a group buy.
The bottom line is probably $20 or less. I can live with that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 358Hammer

I will enjoy having and sharing others velocities and load data! A bit lonely out there currently. Check with Chris @ Benchmark and how he likes the Nitride on his 280AI. Think he mentioned something about 2800fps and that 190 gr Matrix bullet. What he did say several times was the accuracy.

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Chris is very happy with that 280 AI. He mentioned it a few times while I was on the phone with him earlier this week. ;D That's one of the reasons I'm going to have them Nitride my 6BR barrel that they're making for me.

Andrew

Quote:

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Originally Posted by WYcoyote

http://www.snipershide.com/forum/ubb...66#Post2072066


+ shipping it looks like, probably 2 ways. and have to coordinate a group buy.
The bottom line is probably $20 or less. I can live with that.

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You don't have to go through the group buy. Contact MMI direct. I bet it's still cheaper than $100 even with shipping.

FYI Not everyone is reputable and trustworthy.
The first person that turned me onto Nitride charged me $80. per barrel and $140. for a barreled action. I got the first barreled action back in a 3 week period. Though I was told through a telephone call when the next batch was done, it took 4 months and some serious threats from me and others to get a bunch of stuff back to me.
Ever been told six weeks to get something done and 6 months later you still haven't got it? I could not live with the price, no contact and no reason why it took so long.

Next was my wood cutter who I already gave the information on. I do not know what he will charge you because the $45. he quoted me I paid for each of three barrels. I ask if you find that he is jacking up the price to let me know.Benchmark came slightly after me on round one and they two sat and waited months for barrels to return. That may be somewhat spendy for mine or others taste but they have apparently gone with someone who is getting those barrels back in a timely manner. They are honorable and great people to deal with so they can worry about where our barrels are.

If my barreled action doesn't every rust or wear out and looks like a million it is definitely worth the price of a worthless blueing job. Not sure what people charge these days for blueing but memory says $150. for a basic and $400. for the best. Nitride lookes like a $400. blue job.
If guys (and they are) are getting 60,000 rounds out of their M16's shooting military 55gr ball ammo, how many rounds can we get from a 6BR?


In my experience it is a good thing to have a larger company looking out for our stuff. MMI or whomever will normally take great pains to make sure they do not loose a good customer like Benchmark by not getting the job done in a timely manner.

NOTE: I just picked up another 300 RUM barrel because the Nitrided one I am shooting does not have a long enough lead to shoot any bullet over 180grain. For those of you Nitriding before you get the barrel. It might be a good idea to have a loaded round for your smith to use for setting up the gun. He will not be very happy with you if you take a short throated barrel in after Nitriding and not tell him how hard the steel is.


Neal

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Originally Posted by 358Hammer

NOTE: I just picked up another 300 RUM barrel because the Nitrided one I am shooting does not have a long enough lead to shoot any bullet over 180grain. For those of you Nitriding before you get the barrel. It might be a good idea to have a loaded round for your smith to use for setting up the gun. He will not be very happy with you if you take a short throated barrel in after Nitriding and not tell him how hard the steel is.

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I bet that's the last time the smith would ever touch one of your guns if you did that. ;)

Andrew

Hey Neal;

What does the nitride look like if you have a mix of molly and SS does it coat or cover the two the same or will you be able to tell you have lets say a SS recoil lug and a molly action and barrel? Or does the nitriding even work on SS?

Thanks
Scott

Both Stainless and Moly turn out the same color.

[img width=600 height=450]http://i311.photobucket.com/albums/kk460/emeraldislandlover/Patriot338NewLook.jpg[/img]

Neal

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Originally Posted by ESSCEE

Hey Neal;

What does the nitride look like if you have a mix of molly and SS does it coat or cover the two the same or will you be able to tell you have lets say a SS recoil lug and a molly action and barrel? Or does the nitriding even work on SS?

Thanks
Scott

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Good question, I have a blue 111 action and bought a SS recoil lug and barrel nut for my new SS Benchmark barrel, but now I'm getting that nitrided and it may look a little goofy now.

Send the other parts in and have them treated as well.

[img width=600 height=450]http://i311.photobucket.com/albums/kk460/emeraldislandlover/FerraticNitride001.jpg[/img]

Stainless action Nitride barrel.

Neal

I thought I'd read at least one of the places that initially offered the nitriding process (via an accomplished Benchrest shooter who had an 'in') for barrels highly recommended that you got the barrel broken in, or whatever you want to call the first 20-100rds that polishes off the burrs & tooling marks resulting from chambering that nice hand-lapped barrel... BEFORE having the barrel nitrided, because otherwise it would basically be near impossible to do...

Anyone here have experience one way or another along those lines?

The one's that have been doing this with barrels just do not seem to be talking much. I can guess they like the velocity increase over the next guy so do not want to let the cat out of the bag??

I have done 4-5 barrels each way personally. Broke in barrel before Nitriding. Nitrided Benchmark and Factory Savage barrels before shooting. They both shot the very well. Think I have nine barrels Nitrided now and the worst thing to happen is I had to switch from Reloader 17 on two of the barrels to H4831. I might add that the velocity had really stepped up and I felt I needed to go to a slower burning powder to bughole again. It worked both time. In fact the 19" 300 RUM barrel really liked H1000 and 180gr bullets.

Each of us has had that sweet barrel that just won time after time. It is always a bummer when it needs to be replaced. What a wonderful feeling to find a 2-5 thousand round sweet shooting barrel?

Neal

Is there a limit to how many rounds down a tube before having it treated? Say for instance I have a barrel that probably has 2500rds through it, shoots *really* nice, probably one of the best shooting barrels I've had to be honest - and it only seems to get better with more rounds through it. Problem is the throat has moved a bit and if it moves much more, well it'll be too much. Yes, I could have it set back first but its one of those things where its shooting so well I *really* don't want to screw with it - but if I could 'preserve' it at this point and get another several thousand rounds of it that would be pretty awesome ;D

Lets see- You already have fire crack and and the worst way. You indicate you have moved or it has moved the throat. SO one introduces the fire cracking to 1200 degrees for an hour. I am only guessing but I suspect you just finished the barrel off.

I do know someone who lapped a badly fire cracked barrel and had it Nitrided. It worked very well as a tent stake.

Neal

Hmmm... guess I'll have to bore scope it and see how it looks. Normally I don't see a lot of fire cracking in a .308 Win that early in life... if I had to guess I'd say some/a lot of the 'throat movement' may be the recontouring of the throat from the somewhat steeper throat angle that factory tubes usually have to something more like what the bullet is shaped like.

If it was set back an inch, do you think it might work then?

Obviously I *really* like the way this barrel shoots ;)

Just checked with a friend of a friend last night> Someone that beat me to Nitriding a 6.5 WSM has 900 rounds down the pipe without an issue yet. That is well past the life expectancy of the 6.5WSM prior to Nitriding. Accuracy is still right where it was and no sign of wear.

These guys are scoping the throat often and to date there isn't any sign that their barrels have been shot.

Note: In speaking with Chris at Benchmark- they are charging what they charge because they are cleaning the barrels before Nitride and lapping them clean after the Nitride to make sure the barrels are exactly the same quaality as an untreated Benchmark barrel. They are also re-installing that barrel if they have the action it came off of. SO that $100. isn't just for the Nitriding. My 300 RUM barrel did not ship to me prior to Nitride. The smith had to remove the brand new blueing from inside and outside the barrel before it could be sent off. When I got my barrel back NO one cleaned anything after Nitride. There was still salt residue and bath remanents and take my word for it, I have never cleaned a worse bore, ever.

Information

Neal

Followup on Nitride:

A flaw caused by natural procession or neglect?

Last week I sent my 6.5 barrel back to Benchmark though they did not do the Nitriding. I was having a major problem getting the spent cases from the chamber.

They have had a number of Nitrided barrels that when bore scoped looked like frost inside when they came back from Nitriding.. My barrel had the frost and after 250 rounds it looked extremely frosted. Benchmark is handlapping the bores and chambers as previously stated because for whatever reason some of the barrels have that frosting affect so they are smoothing the inside of the barrels so we as the consumer will not have that extraction problem.

We are guessing it is the salt/chemical deposit that can not be cleaned by normal means like I did wwhen I got the barrel back. Plus I haven't a bore scope so I could not see that the chamber needed smoothing from the Frost.
None of my other barrels has shown this but none of the other barrels are a 6.5 WSM.

Just updated information



Neal

Thanks for the info Neal. I'm interested to hear how this works out.

Andrew

I hope with all the extra lapping after the nitride they are not removing the coating we paid for. I trust Benchmark will do us right.
Chris called me on Mon and let me know my 6.5-.284 Norma nitrided barrel is on the way.

Does anyone have a good link for benchmark or am I missing something? a google search really only brings up this thread.

Thanks
Scott

Benchmark does not have a website. " I am too busy now". is a quote from the boys at Benchmark. They wish to stay the size they are and have the time to make a super quality barrel .

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/...e-barrel-line/

Hand lapping after Nitride is intended to make sure those salts and anything else have been removed from the surface only. It is the way it should have been done to my barrel and was not because I went through a new guy and he did not know about the surface salt issue any more than I did. Nitride being incredibly hard I am pretty sure it can not be removed when lapping .
THE LAPPING IS DONE IN A DIFFERENT MANNER than the initual lapping.

I am not going to worry about it as I am sending two more barrels out to have it done. The purpose of this informational is simply to say that not all companies do as great of job at looking out for our best interests. And if someone else down the line has a problem extracting like I did the information is out there and it isn't a barrel quality issue. It is a good process and this is one out of nine barrels that got through because I do not have a bore scope to see it. AT the cost of a scope I won't be having one either.

Neal

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Originally Posted by WYcoyote

I just called Benchmark today and my 6.5-284 Norma Savage pre-fit barrel was done and they were just about to package and ship it, I hit them up about nitriding it, $100. and one week.
Perfect timing, thanks Neal.

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Got my barrel from Benchmark and they charged me $150 for the nitride, called to check, aparently I was mistaken with the $100 amount.
So $150 it cost me for nitriding at Benchmark.