Upgrade old savage 110 vs buy an Axis II

I got this early model 110 in 308, pre-accutrigger that shoots very well, bolt is smooth, trigger is great, but has occasional light strikes & weak ejection. I was wondering if it was possible to upgrade this thing with a newer style bolt head and rebarrel or will that not work? Ideally I would like to change the stock out as well and maybe even DBM upgrade. This was a very early model with the old style spring extractor and magazine mounted ejector.

My other idea is to just get an Axis (and upgrade the trigger), or an Axis II with a heavy barrel and call it a day, maybe upgrade the stock.

What would you do?

Tough call.

Have you stripped the bolt down cleaned it and or replaced the spring?

Checked firing pin protrusion to see if ok?

Do you reload?

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Originally Posted by RC20

Tough call.

Have you stripped the bolt down cleaned it and or replaced the spring?

Checked firing pin protrusion to see if ok?

Do you reload?

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I have stripped the bolt and changed the clip extractor, I'm starting to think the extraction issue could maybe be the magazine mounted ejector being worn?

I have not replaced the spring but I did check and adjust the firing pin protrusion and it helped but didn't completely fix the light strikes.

I would like to get into reloading in the near future but not yet.

Keep the 308 and fix it, but buy a 6.5 creedmoor axis II

What BEARCATRP said.

Your older Savage most likely has a stagger feed action. I don't believe you will be able to convert to a DBM stock. An Axis II XP Hardwood would be more cost effective than trying to upgrade your current rifle or starting with an Axis and adding a better trigger and aftermarket stock. Wait for the online Christmas promotional offers from Savage Arms and I bet you can get an additional $50 dollar rebate from Savage Arms on the Axis II.

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Originally Posted by jpdown

Your older Savage most likely has a stagger feed action. I don't believe you will be able to convert to a DBM stock. An Axis II XP Hardwood would be more cost effective than trying to upgrade your current rifle or starting with an Axis and adding a better trigger and aftermarket stock. Wait for the online Christmas promotional offers from Savage Arms and I bet you can get an additional $50 dollar rebate from Savage Arms on the Axis II.

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Cdiprecision makes DBM bottom metal for my savage according to them. And MDT makes the LSS system which also has a model compatible with the stagger feed. Still all of this is useless unless I know whether or not its possible update the bolt head and barrel.

I found a heavy barrel axis for under $300 and the $50 rebate is already active. So about $250 + 100 for trigger puts me at $350 and MDT LSS also makes a chassis for it.

Another option is the Cabeall only 10T in 6.5 Creed, heavy barrel, 5R rifling, Plastic stock but not bad. Acu trigger. Bottom release thing I don't like. smooth nut but that would not be an issue for a long time and can be taken off with right technique.

I think under $500 with rebates and deals at times.

wood stock from Boyds.

I understand that axis rifles can be very good shooters but I think even though they can be had for cheap there are better values to be had in the 10, 12, 11 etc.

The biggest thing is the trigger. $100 or so to get a replacement for the axis. That puts you at the same price as a 12 fv that is ready to shoot right out of the box and the 10 12, 11, 110 etc all have way more aftermarket support as far as stocks and parts go.

In my opinion the standard savage rifle is much better than the axis to boot.

Believe me I took a long hard look at the axis to build a rifle on. After crunching the numbers it really doesn't make sense to buy one and put money into modifying it. It does make sense to buy one and use it as is for an economy hunting rifle.

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Originally Posted by RC20

Another option is the Cabeall only 10T in 6.5 Creed, heavy barrel, 5R rifling, Plastic stock but not bad. Acu trigger. Bottom release thing I don't like. smooth nut but that would not be an issue for a long time and can be taken off with right technique.

I think under $500 with rebates and deals at times.

wood stock from Boyds.

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I was going to suggest this too as I just bought one. It's the best value right now. It comes with a egw base, accutrigger, accustock, oversized bolt, 5r button rifling.

The accustock is completely underrated by some on here. There is absolutely nothing wrong with it. My only gripe would be the cheek rest doesn't come up enough but an aftermarket cheek pad can be had for cheap and it really isn't a big deal unless you are picky.

The accustock is a great value and I'd pick it over a laminated Boyds stock.

I mean preferably I would like to get the old Savage goin' as it was my dads and it would be cool to see it all modernized. Assuming everything is compatible, upgrading my current savage would actually be the most economical option for building a higher end precision setup. Let's say $400 for the lss chassis or a nice stock with cdi bottom metal, plus the cost of a barrel and bolt head. Could put me around $700 for a pretty decked out setup. Assuming it all works.

Heavy barrel axis with trigger upgrade = $350, which would be not be bad in itself, and I could later swap over to lss chassis for a total of around $750.

I have looked at the 10 with heavy barrel and 5r rifling and it's definitely amongst my list of options. But I do like building guns and tinkering so I'm not really leaning in that direction.

The 10t was $500 on sale from $600. It's ready to shoot right out of the box. Don't forget it comes with a nice oversized bolt handle and scope base that I'd value at about $80 (ballpark). You are talking about a proven quality sub moa rifle with a few extras for $500! Did I mention it has dbm too?

Even if you still want to build and tinker this would be a solid platform to start. And you can be shooting while you save for the real nice stuff. Take the extra $250 ($750 you said you'd spend) and put it toward a reloading kit. You will save a ton of money reloading. No manufacturer can reload bullets as you can for your particular rifle. You will shoot better regardless of what rifle you decide on.

Let's rewind some. Does anyone know if the bolt head can be upgraded to the newer style on this old savage? The 10t is nice and all but it's more than I want to spend, plus I want to get this old rifle running well again.

It is hard to advise you on a new bolt head without more information on the model year and maybe some pictures of the disassembled rifle, stock and bolt head. I believe the Savage LA bolt head shank length and firing pin hole size have changed over the years. The newer model push feed bolt heads may not work. Check barrel headspace and shoulder length of unfired and fired brass. The firing pin may be pushing the unfired cartridge forward in the chamber resulting in light primer strikes. Get a new bolt head kit (Gun Shack) and replace parts to resolve ejection issues. The small springs weaken and the holes fill with crude over time. I doubt replacing the bolt head is necessary to get your "old rifle running well".

I would definitely keep the original 10, and work on building it. You can start with this bolt head: http://pacifictoolandgauge.com/savag...olt-heads.html They don't specify specific years. I believe it works on them all. I also use & recommend PTG for a new barrel nut and recoil lug when time for a new barrel. I bought a used model 10 JUST for the action to build it into a one off. Look at my build thread here to see it. Anyway, that bolt head, and new bolt internals should get your ejection back, and may even pick up a shade of accuracy. Then build it as money allows. The MDT chassis/stock is a good idea. I have the TAC21 and LOVE IT!

Do you have a micrometer available? I would start by measuring your bolt head and determining the dimensions of it. Then take that information and compare to the modern bolt head dimensions.

You will have to change the bbl with the bolt head if its possible to upgrade.

Lastly you might just buy a newer style bolt head (I think they are about $30 for a factory model) and see if it will even install. if it doesn't work, I'm sure somebody on the forum will relieve you of it.

Edit: see below

from user geargrinder in 2012,

"Correct. In order to turn this one into a swapper, you'd need a barrel, nut, complete bolt, magazine, and follower. In the old actions, the standing ejector is part of the magazine.

Unless you got it very cheap, or have extraordinary desire, the old actions aren't worth converting."

http://www.savageshooters.com/archive/index.php/t-18984.html

OK now we're getting somewhere

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Originally Posted by jpdown

It is hard to advise you on a new bolt head without more information on the model year and maybe some pictures of the disassembled rifle, stock and bolt head. I believe the Savage LA bolt head shank length and firing pin hole size have changed over the years. The newer model push feed bolt heads may not work. Check barrel headspace and shoulder length of unfired and fired brass. The firing pin may be pushing the unfired cartridge forward in the chamber resulting in light primer strikes. Get a new bolt head kit (Gun Shack) and replace parts to resolve ejection issues. The small springs weaken and the holes fill with crude over time. I doubt replacing the bolt head is necessary to get your "old rifle running well".

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I replaced the bolt head extractor band which helped some but I think the issue is the magazine mounted ejector. I will definitely check headspace out I never thought of that! I'm still thinking it's probably the firing pin spring but we'll see.

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Originally Posted by Dave Hoback

I would definitely keep the original 10, and work on building it. You can start with this bolt head: http://pacifictoolandgauge.com/savag...olt-heads.html They don't specify specific years. I believe it works on them all. I also use & recommend PTG for a new barrel nut and recoil lug when time for a new barrel. I bought a used model 10 JUST for the action to build it into a one off. Look at my build thread here to see it. Anyway, that bolt head, and new bolt internals should get your ejection back, and may even pick up a shade of accuracy. Then build it as money allows. The MDT chassis/stock is a good idea. I have the TAC21 and LOVE IT!

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Let's hope it works out! My buddy just ordered an FCP-SR so maybe I can compare his bolt to mine or something.

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Originally Posted by RustyShackle

Do you have a micrometer available? I would start by measuring your bolt head and determining the dimensions of it. Then take that information and compare to the modern bolt head dimensions.


You will have to change the bbl with the bolt head if its possible to upgrade.


Lastly you might just buy a newer style bolt head (I think they are about $30 for a factory model) and see if it will even install. if it doesn't work, I'm sure somebody on the forum will relieve you of it.


Edit: see below


from user geargrinder in 2012,


"Correct. In order to turn this one into a swapper, you'd need a barrel, nut, complete bolt, magazine, and follower. In the old actions, the standing ejector is part of the magazine.


Unless you got it very cheap, or have extraordinary desire, the old actions aren't worth converting."


http://www.savageshooters.com/archiv...p/t-18984.html

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Okay yes that setup you linked has the same trigger and bolt as mine. Hmm that does raise the price a bit unless I can find an entire bolt for cheap. I was already going to change the barrel (my action does have a nut) for something with a heavier profile, and the magazine was also a given as I would be going to a DBM setup.

Now I have to think because doing all that would basically fix my extraction/firing issues but there wouldn't be much of the old rifle left lol. And if I fix it I might as well leave it as is. Would it be possible to have someone make a barrel that is compatible with my old 110? I worry that what if I go forward with this and my parts/trigger end up not working with the new chassis/bottom metal.

I'm noticing that the bolt itself looks exactly the same as the newer style 110e style bolt. Are we absolutely sure the bolt heads won't swap?

JP down is correct. Is this your bolt head design?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...10bolthead.jpg




If it is, buying a bolt head that does not work on your bolt will fix nothing. Try and find a newer model 10, 11, 12, 14, 16 with a round back of the receiver.

yeah i guess i'll just fix it and buy something else.

Anyway, about the 10t.... haha

You CAN NOT upgrade to a newer style bolt head without replacing the entire bolt assembly. The reason why is because the cross pin that holds the bolt head to the bolt body is different. On the newer style the cross pin is vertical (perpendicular to the lugs), while on the early guns it's horizontal (parallel to the lugs).

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...omparison2.jpg

A new bolt isn't a million dollars. Might as well pick up a nice one anyway. I have an extra Savage bolt laying around at all times. NEVER KNOW when I might need one.

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Originally Posted by redman

Anyway, about the 10t.... haha

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lolol

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Originally Posted by MrFurious

You CAN NOT upgrade to a newer style bolt head without replacing the entire bolt assembly. The reason why is because the cross pin that holds the bolt head to the bolt body is different. On the newer style the cross pin is vertical (perpendicular to the lugs), while on the early guns it's horizontal (parallel to the lugs).

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...omparison2.jpg

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true dat. thanks

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Originally Posted by toddcdozer

A new bolt isn't a million dollars. Might as well pick up a nice one anyway. I have an extra Savage bolt laying around at all times. NEVER KNOW when I might need one.

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i mean i guess i could still do it but all that would be left over from the original gun would be the action/trigger itself...assuming it would even work in a modern chassis. i think my best bet is to fix the gun and build up something else in 6.5

You'll find that if you mount that action in a modern stock the original trigger will only stick through the bottom about 1/2". The older trigger groups were shorter in overall height than the newer (1966 and up) triggers. As such you would have to update to an aftermarket trigger if you change to a newer stock.

This is why we generally recommend everyone just leave the pre-1966 guns alone and find something else to build from. Everything available from the aftermarket is designed for the newer stuff so the only thing useful for a build from the pre-66's is the bare action itself. Better to leave the old ones alone and just go buy a Trophy Hunter or Axis to build off of.

I got a old 243 savage that has the old style bolt head and wanted to do the same thing.
I already had a bolt head to swap out so I started looking at things closer and found that the old bolt head has the retaining pin going though in different direction.
So I used a long action bolt body to modify the length to the old body length and timed the pin to the new bolt heads. Then firing pin needs altered and and magazine ejector removed. The firing pin had to be shortened and turned down part of length. It can be done.
probably best for a gunsmith to do it. . I didn't change the stock just the bolt so I can swap out barrels with other savages.