How much is enough? (magnification)

I finally got some range time this past Saturday, and managed to get my Axis (308) dialed in with the packaged scope. It's not a great scope, but it's repeatable, and I like all my equipment in atleast operational shape.

Anyways, it's a 4-12 scope, which I plan on replacing near the end of this year. I noticed at 100, I could see shots on plain white paper, and at 200, I could make out my shots on a shoot-n-see target, but both were a touch difficult. I didn't have a spotting scope, that's going to be rectified soon.

I've been looking at upgrading the scope this winter, I just needed to make sure the gun was repeatable before I thought about it. I want to get the Bushnell Elite Tactical 6-24. The question is, is 24 enough? I may shoot 500-800 a total of 3 times (there is a long range class I want to take to learn better marksman ship and techniques). Mostly, 300 will be my max. I don't even know where to go for a 300 range, but 200 is easy to find.

The second option would be to drop back to the Bushnell Elite 6500, which comes in 4.5-30, and save a few bucks. The Elite Tactical is better glass though, and comes with the reticle I want.

Most of my scopes are 32 power, I not only want to see the squirrel I want to see up the squirrels @ss, I also keep it there at high magnification and try to be as steady as I can at 32X, and when I turn it down to 20X I am rock steady, if you have it you can crank it up and always turn it down but you can't turn it up if you don't have it.

Dean

i also have a 32x scope and it been on 32x maybe 4 times in 6 yrs...i also have a 25x scope that ive used out to 1845yds...high magnification is nice "IF" you spend the money on high end glass...the problem with high mag scopes is like scope eye said if your not real steady it looks like you reticle is a jumping bean and the mirage magnified as well.

They only reason I don't have any of Sightron's 50 power scopes, is because I cant afford them. I would have them cranked up even at a 25 yard Shot.

Dean

LOL...maybe you need to look at the 80x march

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Originally Posted by scope eye

Most of my scopes are 32 power, I not only want to see the squirrel I want to see up the squirrels @ss, I also keep it there at high magnification and try to be as steady as I can at 32X, and when I turn it down to 20X I am rock steady, if you have it you can crank it up and always turn it down but you can't turn it up if you don't have it.

Dean

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Depends. General rule of thumb is at least 1x for every 100 yds for deer hunting. Target work requires more if you want to be more precise. I like 3-9 for General hunting guns.

Then it comes down to personal preference.

I can't afford a $1000.00 scope let alone a $4000.00 one.

http://marchscopes.com/tactical-8-80-x-56.html

Dean

Have the 24x and the 30x......they spend more time on 24x or 30x than anywhere in between. 24x enough? Yes. 30x to much? No. it is just a 24x with a +6 option.
Win/Win.

Sounds like your set on a Bushnell. But you may want to check out the Sightron SIII line of scopes. Big Supply Shop usually has the best prices http://www.bigsupplyshop.com/Optics_c_15.html

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Originally Posted by scope eye

I can't afford a $1000.00 scope let alone a $4000.00 one.

http://marchscopes.com/tactical-8-80-x-56.html

Dean

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sell off 30 of the 1000 barrels you have and you can lol

I would rather give up a Kidney, it would hurt less.

Dean

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Originally Posted by jpdown

Sounds like your set on a Bushnell. But you may want to check out the Sightron SIII line of scopes. Big Supply Shop usually has the best prices http://www.bigsupplyshop.com/Optics_c_15.html

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That's not bad, but I can get the Bushnell for for that price, which as the zero stops for quick reset, and I've personally have had good luck with the name.

Scope power is pretty much a personal thing. I have an 8x32 also but rarly have it over 20x regardless of distance.
I can get by very well with a 12x scope for long range hunting. Clarity is the main thing for me, and regardless
of the scope quality, clarity goes down as the power goes up. Especially in the east where there is a high moisture
content in the air. If i were forced to pick a single power for a scope or the large binnoculars we use to hunt with
it would be 15x. We usually start out glassing on 20 to 30 power in the glasses. But before noon were often changing
the eyepieces to 15x because of the mirage or moisture.

The zero stop on the Bushnells are the worst design of all the zero stops. Make sure you follow the directions to a "T" because if you don't you can easily end up off a full revolution from your zero. I just switched from a Vortex Razor Gen 1 5-20x50 to a Gen 2 4.5-27x56. While the extra magnification is nice, the larger benefit is the glass staying clear, eye box not shrinking, and the thinner reticle in the primary 8-20x range that is most used in my case. You can buy a scope with a ton of magnification, but if it can perform at the higher mag what's the point?

I've looked through a lot of high end scopes. Not a lot beats the Vortex Gen 2 for the money and the offered features are better then the additional $1,000 you'd spend for a "higher quality" optic. Most of the guys I know stay in the 10-15x range most of the time, but sometimes the extra mag is handy.

If you don't have great eyesight the higher mag with quality glass may be an asset though. Hard to spot your shots on max power though if a follow up shot may be required.

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Originally Posted by jpdown

Sounds like your set on a Bushnell. But you may want to check out the Sightron SIII line of scopes. Big Supply Shop usually has the best prices http://www.bigsupplyshop.com/Optics_c_15.html

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Really like my sightron. Really Love my bushnells.

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Originally Posted by tweiss3

I finally got some range time this past Saturday, and managed to get my Axis (308) dialed in with the packaged scope. It's not a great scope, but it's repeatable, and I like all my equipment in atleast operational shape.

Anyways, it's a 4-12 scope, which I plan on replacing near the end of this year. I noticed at 100, I could see shots on plain white paper, and at 200, I could make out my shots on a shoot-n-see target, but both were a touch difficult. I didn't have a spotting scope, that's going to be rectified soon.

I've been looking at upgrading the scope this winter, I just needed to make sure the gun was repeatable before I thought about it. I want to get the Bushnell Elite Tactical 6-24. The question is, is 24 enough? I may shoot 500-800 a total of 3 times (there is a long range class I want to take to learn better marksman ship and techniques). Mostly, 300 will be my max. I don't even know where to go for a 300 range, but 200 is easy to find.

The second option would be to drop back to the Bushnell Elite 6500, which comes in 4.5-30, and save a few bucks. The Elite Tactical is better glass though, and comes with the reticle I want.

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For what you're looking to do any quality mid-range 6.5-20 or 6-24x would be more than adequate. For that magnification range I would highly recommend sticking with scopes priced at $400 and up to assure good clear lenses and quality coatings to get the best performance at the higher settings.

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Originally Posted by J. Baker

For what you're looking to do any quality mid-range 6.5-20 or 6-24x would be more than adequate. For that magnification range I would highly recommend sticking with scopes priced at $400 and up to assure good clear lenses and quality coatings to get the best performance at the higher settings.

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Originally Posted by J. Baker

For what you're looking to do any quality mid-range 6.5-20 or 6-24x would be more than adequate. For that magnification range I would highly recommend sticking with scopes priced at $400 and up to assure good clear lenses and quality coatings to get the best performance at the higher settings.

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Thanks for the confirmation. I certainly don't see myself trying at 1000, atleast not with this gun or caliber.

You can never have too much if the weather permits. If mirage gets bad you just zoom it down. As for not trying 1000 with that gun or caliber, the gun may not do it but the caliber will get there just fine. I have seen more than one 200 score in 1000 yard palma matches with a 308 and that is with peep sights.
Just remember you get what you pay for most of the time. Cheap scopes will always be cheap scopes. Those that say a $250 scope is just as clear and does just as good a job as a $1000 scope either got lucky or has never looked thru a high quality scope. Out to 300 yards a good 400 to 800 dollar scope will do you just fine and the higher quality scope will still be useful is you ever decide to reach way out there. The higher the power the worse mirage will affect your view. It is there with even a 1 power red dot you just don't notice it as much. Whatever you decide good luck.

I have made 6 consecutive hits on the 5" plate at 1000 yards with my SWFA 12X fixed scope on my 260 Rem LRP. It cracks me up when people talk about needing 20X+ at 500-600 yards. :)

I have subsequently upgraded to an SWFA 5-20 on my primary bolt action but I still use the SWFA 12X fixed scopes on other rifles out to 1200 yds.

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Originally Posted by Onewolf

I have made 6 consecutive hits on the 5" plate at 1000 yards with my SWFA 12X fixed scope on my 260 Rem LRP. It cracks me up when people talk about needing 20X+ at 500-600 yards. :)

I have subsequently upgraded to an SWFA 5-20 on my primary bolt action but I still use the SWFA 12X fixed scopes on other rifles out to 1200 yds.

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Just depends on what your using it for...If your shooting small targets like rock chucks or even coyotes it can be hard to pick them out of there surroundings at distance with a 12x.
I also like high magnification so I do need to concentrate so hard on my breathing......At 20x if your breathing is off the whole reticle reminds you by wobbling all over and a good position is really obvious. At 10x or 12x even a bad position can look pretty good.

So are you saying that when using iorn sights a bad position isnt visable at longer distances?
I never knew proper position had anything to do with the power or type of sights.

You can train around it but yes. Proper position and breathing are critical to accuracy. The magnification just makes it more obvious if you don't have it. I know that i bought into the whole 10x is enough filosophy but higher mag helped me fix problems I didn't know existed.

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Originally Posted by D.ID

You can train around it but yes. Proper position and breathing are critical to accuracy. The magnification just makes it more obvious if you don't have it. I know that i bought into the whole 10x is enough filosophy but higher mag helped me fix problems I didn't know existed.

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What then is the (proper definition) of (proper position)?
Meaning, what is it, and how would one know if he has it correct?
And since we have so many (gunsmiths) on this site, maybe somebody can tell me what headspace actually is and the (proper) definition for that?
No fair googleing either.

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Originally Posted by yobuck

What then is the (proper definition) of (proper position)?
Meaning, what is it, and how would one know if he has it correct?
And since we have so many (gunsmiths) on this site, maybe somebody can tell me what headspace actually is and the (proper) definition for that?
No fair googleing either.

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Proper is stable. Whatever it takes to get stable.

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Originally Posted by D.ID

Proper is stable. Whatever it takes to get stable.

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Well a bench is stable, at least the good ones are.
So maybe the proper answer is use a bench?
Im not sure i can shoot 10xs from a bench, so maybe my bench position is wrong also?

Bipod for me

How about re read the question. Its not about what personal preferences are, but how does say a newbie know, if he is in the proper prone or any other position?

Reread the answer. Whatever it takes.
That is actually why i recomend a little extra magnification. It would be obvious even to an amateur.
Sometimes it's as simple as kicking an elbow in or out.
At 20x you can see it, at 10x you might not notice it.

So then, one vote for just making the bod all comfy and then use scope power to see if the breathing is affecting your usually perfect score.
See, at my age im told to check to see if im actually breathing at all, and dont worry about what the scope says. So being comfy is about it for me?
Im assuming that like me your not a gunsmith, and thats why you chose not to tackle the headspace question.
And no doubt the ones with the answer are very busy planning the next build?

Headspace is the extra area inside your hat that your head could use if it were to swell (as in get the big head)

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Originally Posted by yobuck

So then, one vote for just making the bod all comfy and then use scope power to see if the breathing is affecting your usually perfect score.
See, at my age im told to check to see if im actually breathing at all, and dont worry about what the scope says. So being comfy is about it for me?
Im assuming that like me your not a gunsmith, and thats why you chose not to tackle the headspace question.
And no doubt the ones with the answer are very busy planning the next build?

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It's a life.........sometimes you can help someone accelerate the learning curve.......and sometimes your just waisting time on the internet.
Not a gunsmith but I have built..........."assembled" enough to know what works.

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Originally Posted by earl39

Headspace is the extra area inside your hat that your head could use if it were to swell (as in get the big head)

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Your very close to the right answer lol. But the question was on guns.
Im beginning to feel guilty for asking such tough questions.

The proper answer to the OP's question is,, if you don't want to buy a spotting scope and you want to see your bullet holes at 200 and 300 yards get a 30X to 36X scope.

I like to be able to zoom in. LOL

Sightron has a fixed 36 power scope that is very good for target shooting,, under $500.