Has anyone heard what aftermarket parts will be available for the new Edge models? Drop in barrels, stocks and so on. I have heard pretty good things about them so far and for the money its hard to beat.
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Has anyone heard what aftermarket parts will be available for the new Edge models? Drop in barrels, stocks and so on. I have heard pretty good things about them so far and for the money its hard to beat.
The Edge, has limited aftermarket parts availability, and I am fairly sure it will remain that way. If you want a gun that you can change or modify then you should seriously look at the Stevens 200. The Stevens is only a few dollars more, but has a ton of potential, and a boat load of aftermarket parts.
If you still must believe you need an Edge I will list every available part for it in the following list.
1. EGW picatinny rail.
There you go.
The Edge will accept aftermarket barrels from a Savage, but the stock is so thin you only choice is sporter barrels. The Edge share no other parts.
Unless you are not a look at only type of guy you can add allot of stuff, barrel, stock, bolt handle to name a few, or just about anything you want to do. ;D
You can open your stock for a heavy barrel, that's why they make dremel tools and sandpaper believe me it looks good...
Of course those ""entry level"" guns are for US BEGINNERS!
The Edge will not use a Savage bolt handle or stock.Quote:
Originally Posted by Everett
If people deluged Boyds with a request for stocks for the Edge, we would get them in short order (I've been bugging them).
But here's a question for you: If you put Edge hardware into a wooden or otherwise aftermarket stock have you not voided the whole concept of the Edge as a lightweight, cheap, yet accurate firearm? Might as well buy another rifle such as a 110 or Stevens to begin with.
Well, when I get my Edge home I plan to make a nice wood stock for it. I'll post pics of the project as it goes along, if anyone is interested.
I would like to see a wood stock for the Edge I have been bugging Boyds as well
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Some civil discourse follows: Although I may disagree with others in what I say below, I am neither upset, nor am I attacking anyone personally.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 82boy
Quote:
Originally Posted by sayak
In another (similar) thread, a poster stated:
I question the logic of the above post. (Of course, I could be wrong :D)Quote:
The reason there's little to no aftermarket support for the Axis/Edge models is because most accessories would cost as much (or more) as the rifle itself and those buying these lower end rifles aren't the type to dump 2-3x what the gun cost into accessories. How many people are going to pay $300 for a stock or $300-400 for a barrel to put on a $250 gun? Not many as those wanting to customize would have been smart enough to buy a 110 to start with. Pretty much the same deal with the Model 25's.
After reading numerous postings in this forum, it is clear to me that many forum members purchase used Savage or even new Stevens 200 rifle for builds, and then purchase and install accessories that "cost as much (or more) as the rifle itself" Would most people deliberately purchase a more expensive rifle to modify if they could get the same features in a less expensive rifle? Granted some purchase an expensive rifle because they want certain features and go about changing a some of the features they don't like, but many people purchase new or used rifles at low prices and then purchase expensive parts to install on them. I would suggest that the fact that the accessories are more expensive than the rifle does not deter anyone from purchasing and installing them.
I believe (opinion, here, I have not conducted scientific studies) that many members of this forum would love to get their hands on a $250 or lower priced gun so they could modify it. (How many forum members purchased the $179 Stevens 200s that were on sale about a year or so ago at a sporting goods chain {was it Academy Sports?}?) I believe people would love to purchase an action or a rifle for that price. If it were a rifle, so much the better. The parts they remove might be able to be sold, thereby offsetting the ultimate price of whatever accessories they might purchase.
I agree that forum members who want to "build," "modify," or "accessorize" their rifles usually purchase Savage 10 or 110 rifles and actions (or their variants). I assert that this is because a) the actions make accurate rifles, and b) because the aftermarket parts and accessories are available. If those same parts and accessories were available for the Axis I believe (again, my opinion...) that people would be purchasing and modifying the Axis just as much. I believe there is nothing inherently "bad" about the Axis that makes it a poor rifle from which to build a modified custom rifle except for the current unavailability of parts.
Personally, I believe the best course of action is for Axis owners to make their desires for aftermarket parts known to the various manufacturers and retailers of those types of parts. If the businessmen think they can make a good enough profit, they will manufacture the parts. If they don't think the demand justifies it, they won't bother. (As with many things, "follow the money.")
Again, I am not upset, I am not ranting, and anyone may feel free to disagree with me or my logic - or lack thereof :D.
However, I thought I would respond to some of the thoughts and what I perceive as logical fallacies floating around this forum and this seemed as good a place as any.
Enjoy, and stay safe out there.
All the best.
(Thomae quickly presses the "Post" button and then hides under the desk to avoid being hit by the incoming responses!)
[quote=thomae ]
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If you look at date when this responce was written, at that time there was no RB trigger availible for the Axis.Quote:
Originally Posted by 82boy
Well, I'll be.....
Attention to detail: Somewhat lacking on my part ::) !
I didn't look at the dates...hadn't seen the thread before and had presumed it was current...didn't realize your post was 16 months old.
What can I say? You got me there! +10 points for you, -10 points for me :-[.
All the best,
I'm questioning the logic of all this. For those of you who own an Axis or Edge, you really need to study the very basics of it's manufacture.
Study the stock, and tell me why a plastic injected stock is inexpensive to make.
Study the receiver, and tell me how many machining operations were eliminated compared to a model 12.
Study the fire control mechanism and tell me why it is designed to "float". Take it out of the stock and you will see what I mean.
The Axis rifles cost $75.00 less than a Stevens 200 to [b]manufacture.[b] The reason is the new technology applied in the tools used in manufacturing. For the intended purpose, an entry level general purpose rifle, this is a value targeted to a specific price point market.
Don't believe for one moment that this line is gonna to out produce or out sell the current flagship models that have been proven performers.
The 10/110 and it's variants has been around for over 50 years, with over 7 million manufactured. That's a big market for any aftermarket goodies, and a market that will still stay strong, even if they became obsolete tomorrow.
The Axis rifle is not a good candidate for a custom build when better platforms are available at very little cost above the price of an Axis.
Don't get me wrong, I been studying the market for opportunity. To gear up for a new venture into the world of the unknown takes lots of research to find out what customers want, and what they are willing to pay.
Which leads to the next question: What are shooters willing to pay for a stock?
Exactly. These are "budget" rifles that work very well. They are designed for entry level enthusiasts like myself. I'm not going to look into other aftermarket stocks or barrels for this rifle. The best mods you can do to these rifles is mostly homemade ones. Messing with trigger assembly, bedding the stock and maybe putting better scope bases on it is far as I would go and recommend. By the time you pay for an aftermarket stock and different barrel, your right up there with the Stevens and better Savage's. Savage made these rifles cheap so the consumer can pick them up cheap but that does not mean they are of less quality just designed for a certain need.Quote:
Originally Posted by sharpshooter
James
I'd pay $100. I've built up inferior rifles such as the Russian Mosin Nagant just for the challenge and fun. And though the Edge is not inferior, it would be a challenge. It is the same thing as customizing anything: fun to make things the way you want them to be rather than how the factory made them.Quote:
Originally Posted by sharpshooter
Hello everyone,
What is the general assessment of the performance of the Axis' receiver/bolt/action? This is the basic backbone of the rifle. Stocks, triggers, barrels, and optics come and go but is the Axis action design/manufacture a good product?
thomae said "If those same parts and accessories were available for the Axis I believe (again, my opinion...) that people would be purchasing and modifying the Axis just as much. I believe there is nothing inherently "bad" about the Axis that makes it a poor rifle from which to build a modified custom rifle except for the current unavailability of parts."
Would Savage still have a good rifle if they only made the Axis but offered the full benefit of good options for stocks, triggers, and barrels? Could it be that Savage has determined how to make a high performance action at lower cost but that a warming-up time will be required before the large consumer market will accept it? Or has Savage simply generated a lower cost and lower performing action like Remington did with the 710/770?
Andy
It is the bic pen, or bic lighter of guns. It functions, but when it is used up your throw it away and buy another.Quote:
Originally Posted by AASavage
I would quit buying Savage if that was all they offered. The Axis/Edge is no were close to the same caliber of rifle as the 10/110 rifle line is.Quote:
Originally Posted by AASavage
BINGO, whe have a winner!Quote:
Originally Posted by AASavage
Actually, many of the calibers are exactly the same; ;D :D ;) ;D :D ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by 82boy
[size=6pt](I'm here all week!)
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Here's my take on the Savage Axis.
Some people cannot afford to spend but a certain amount of $$$ on a gun. If you hunt then you will also need a good scope. My Nikon scope cost $200.00, which kept me in the low $500.00 range by the time I purchased my gun, sling, scope, bullets, and paid sales tax. I hunt on public land so it's not my main gun, because of our hunting regulations. I do however hunt with a friend who has farmland that we hunt, and so I needed a longer range gun. The axis was in my budget, I read all the reviews, my local gun shop was very impressed with how many they have sold without any complaints. I purchased my axis, took it out and sighted it in. I did the trigger mod, and then I sighted my gun again. All of the sudden I realized this is a really accurate hunting riffle. I like the way it shoots. It's a good gun. It may be a budget gun, but it performs well.
The other side.
With youtube and the sharing on information people can figure out how to make improvements on things. For example I buy a lot of tools at Harbor Freight. I know they are cheap tools. I always read the reviews and only buy the tools with good reviews. Then I go to youtube and see if someone has come up with some type of mod or fix. I know that I can't afford the name brand tool, but if I can save a little money, and then later do some upgrades I'm OK with that. With all the sharing of information on forums lots of people are willing to modify a particular product they purchase now more than ever. The do it yourselfer can easily mod something with the help of the internet. There are lots of people who like to tinker, myself included. Yes I know that it's a Savage Axis but it's my axis and it's exactly the way I like it!
The more expensive guns are turn key, and the average person is not going to take a $500.00+ gun apart and tinker with it. The axis is inexpensive and most of all very simple to work on. This makes the axis a perfect candidate for the do it yourslefer.
Guns are kinda like tools because most people keep them for a life time. It may not make sense to pump $500.00 into a $300.00 gun, but if your never going to sell a gun then why not? Might as well make the gun exactly like you want it.
I would pay $150.00 -$250.00 for a nice synthetic stock. I hunt with my axis and wood get too scratched up for me.
What, specifically, don't you like about the Axis receiver/bolt/action design? I am in no way trying to defend the value of the Axis. I don't have one and am simply trying to discover the extent to which Savage compromised performance for the sake of offering a less expensive product. Is the Axis ACTION inferior to the 10/110?Quote:
The Axis/Edge is no were close to the same caliber of rifle as the 10/110 rifle line is.
The criticisms that I read are about the stock, trigger, and that there isn't much aftermarket support. I find nothing bad about this new low cost action.Quote:
It may be a budget gun, but it performs well.
What if Savage made a turn key high end rifle based on the Axis receiver/bolt/action? That would include a top notch stock, barrel, and trigger.Quote:
The more expensive guns are turn key
Lots of people buy Stevens 200's and then change out the trigger, stock, and even the barrel. Would people do that to an Axis if there were as many stocks and triggers and magazines available for the Axis as there are for the Rem 700?
I am sorry if I am dragging this on, but I haven't found answers to these questions.
Andy
Well, I wanted a cheap project gun. My Axis in 223 will be used as a single shot only, for target shooting and maybe coyote or groundhog. I built a new stock for it, I bought a used Savage 12 VLP barrel with a 1:7 twist that I will install shortly.
So I'll have a rifle capable of shooting heavy bullets at long distances, for less than 700$ canadian. I paid the Axis 300$, got a cheap 4-14/50 scope on it for 120$, I payed the barrel 175$. I'll get an EGW 20MOA base for it (about 50$) and that will be it. I also learned a lot on Savage rifle, I plan on offering laminated stocks (for canadians only) so I now have a model onto which to measure for my stocks.
I think that Axis rifle are not used as much as a base for project because there is no aftermarket support, but I kinda created my own aftermarket, so I'll have a nice axis-based rifle.
To start yes the Axis is an inferior design to the tried and trued Savage design. The part I dislike the most about the axis/Edge rifle is that it doesn't have a tang, and the trigger is free floated. They used a roll pin, and bolting the gun down in the stock to suport the trigger group.Quote:
Originally Posted by AASavage
I also am not a big fan of the firing pin set up, with the spring behind the pin. Not there there is anything wrong with the design, but the biggest problem I seen so far with these guns is the spring digging into the rear screw, and un loading, causeing ingnition problems. The fix is simple by nocking the edge off the spring, and/or placing a washer between the screw and spring.
Next thing I dont care about the Axis/edge is Savage removed the rear baffel and incorperated it in to the action. Savage claimes a "Smooth" bolt opperation, but I dont see it. I find that the bolt opperation is much harder than a Savage, but it fools people do to the lighter spring set up with the rear spring. My complaint is I find that the edge/Axis is short on primary extraction.
Other problems with the axis/edge is the magazine set up, with the plastic cap. I find that plastic is a wonderful componete but I question is durability when flexed back and forth for mutiple amounts of times. It also by design makes setting up an aftermarket stock a pin in the but. About the only way it can be done is using the axis/edge multi purpous trigger guard.
Last thing I hate about the Axis/edge is do to the high volume of sales savage will be droping the Stevens 200 line.
The criticisms that I read are about the stock, trigger, and that there isn't much aftermarket support. I find nothing bad about this new low cost action.Quote:
Originally Posted by AASavage [quote
What if Savage made a turn key high end rifle based on the Axis receiver/bolt/action? That would include a top notch stock, barrel, and trigger.
Andy
[/quote]
Well, this is not the point, when makers upgrade stuff the raise the price. The Axis/Edge already has a top notch barrel, it is the same barrel found on a Savage rifle. If you have Savage put a more expensive stock, and better trigger on the gun they would then be in the pricing point of their Savage rifles, and this would miss the whole marketing point. The Edge rifle was designed to compeate with the Remington 770. Savage cliames that they could not produce the Stevens at a cost to compeate with this gun, so in a record time span the compleated a gun that would.
Now lets look closer into savage market. Somewere around 85-90% of savages maket is in hunting rifles, that people will never change a thing about them. They wil take them out of the box, and shot them, and do this year after year. The people on this site that modify their guns are a small part of savage market. Now for the person that wants a good preforming hunting rifle, and they will pull it out the box, mount a scope and shoot it, and never change a thing, the Edge would be a good fit to them. But for the guy wanting to build a gun or modify it the edge is a poor fit, where the Savage 10/110 is a far better fit.
If you compairing accuracy, and if this is where your going with the Edge/axis thing, well lets put it this way, the edge/Axis has savage accuracy, why becuase it all lies in the barrel. Whe it comes down to accuracy the action has little to do with it, it is all in the barrel and bullets.
Thank you, 82boy, for taking the time to give me some specific details. You have probably already explained these points on this forum, but I failed to find it. I really appreciate your patience.
bobfortier: You have now invested significantly in the Axis so I would assume that you will not quickly abandon it and that you would shoot it much more than the average Axis buyer. I would be interested in knowing your feelings about your rifle as the number of rounds fired grows.
Andy
I would probably purchase the Stevens 200 just because of the aftermarket support. I never had any intentions of wanting to modify or build on the Axis platform. I watched youtube video reviews, and then I found this forum when I wanted to work on the trigger.
I would not purchase I higher end Axis. This may sound stupid, but this market is for the do it yourselfers / want to learn how to work on a gun line. Some people want a product that is ready to go in perfect working condition. They will always buy the best they can possibly afford. Then there is the ones who like the idea of a fixer-upper. It's not so much about saving money over the long haul. It is about saving a little money on the front end. As you get the extra cash you do a little upgrade, and eventually you have exactly what you want, but most importantly it was built by you!
It's the same idea as people who restore old cars, fix up and remodel old houses. In the end you may not save any money, but you have something that is exactly what you wanted.
That's my view of the Axis. It is the entry level budget gun, but it's also the gun for those of us who like to tinker.
Well, I can't see the benefit of tinkering with something that is basically inferior. If I were to modify a car, I would start with something that had at least one very valuable asset. The Stevens 200 and the Axis are very comparable in price. A used Savage 10/110 with a beat up stock, ratty trigger, and abused barrel is pretty cheap but may have a very valuable receiver on which to base a top performing build. The Axis has a marginal stock, ratty trigger, and a good barrel. If the Axis receiver is also inferior then the only keeper is the barrel and I would be ahead by starting off with a Stevens or a used Savage or a used Stevens. Clearly, in the world of car "building" some individuals begin with a turkey, end with no original parts, and spend a lot of money in between. This is foolish.
However, if the Axis receiver is an undiscovered jewel and the consumer is mistaken in thinking the Axis receiver is a compromise, then we will have missed an opportunity.
82boy points out some serious shortcomings of the basic Axis receiver design. Anyone care to express agreement or disagreement?
Andy
Well if my inferior,cheap Axis keeps shooting such small groupings, I think I'll hang on to it.
And this is the Edge/Axis section for people who want to talk about them. I already bought one and will likely buy a couple more.
I will say that the bolt cycle is not the smoothest probably due to the extra length but it has never miss fed. Luckily I don't cycle the bolt fast, as tho enemy forces are bearing down on me, at the range. And the magazine is cheap/flimsy and you have to be carefull with it. The length of pull is really long too, but I'm tall and it fits me fine.
If they make more parts for the edge/axis I will buy them.
After I got my Savage Axis, I managed to improperly sight my rifle in. I was hunting and manged to miss a deer three times. I was forever more shucking some shells! It may not be as smooth as other rifles, but when I was in a hurry I managed to put three rounds in few seconds without any issues at all. Most of my issues have occurred because I did not have the clip properly attached to the stock. The stock and the clip are my only complaints.Quote:
Originally Posted by superloggy
I will say this one thing I like about the Axis is the price. I have walked through thorns and thickets and not worried about scratching my gun! I hunted with a Browning A bolt for a while. I loved that gun, but I was constantly worried about scratching the stock.
I agree that if someone is looking for a gun to build on, the Axis is not the best choice because of the lack of aftermarket parts. For those like myself that purchased their Axis/Edge mainly because we know it doesn't take a $1000 rifle to take deer size game, the Axis is hard to beat and in MHO is way better than the Remington 770. I own (2) 7mm-08 and .233 which will bring down anything that I hunt. I have the trigger on both of mine lightened to 1 1/2 - 2 lbs by digital scale and the bolt is noticably smoother after properly cleaning the bore and action with boiling water, dish soap and some Brasso. I've owned a Savage 116 Weather Warrior 30-06 that is 12 yrs old and will drive tacks with my handloads (Price this gun now!) and both my Axis rifles have the same inherent Savage accuracy. Enough said.Quote:
Originally Posted by seanmurphy265