Ok, what does everyone suggest I do for the barrel-breakin on my new Savage Axis Youth 243???
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Ok, what does everyone suggest I do for the barrel-breakin on my new Savage Axis Youth 243???
Just shoot it.
+1, but stand by for a rebuttal.Quote:
Originally Posted by thirty06
i'm waiting for the rebuttals, i know they are out there ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by yobuck
Here's the straight dope on breaking in your barrel. Pay attention.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRRahHX9Zkg
Wow, it's not even April 1st yet .... ok, guys, cute answers :D but I am looking for some SERIOUS help here.
Here is what a couple of the major barrel makers have to say about break-in...
http://www.kriegerbarrels.com/Break_...246-wp2558.htm
http://www.riflebarrels.com/support/...aintenance.htm
About as many opinions on break-in as there are people here.
Good luck
Gary
Thank you Gary :)Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryB
Got me :) While I was being cute, I was also being serious. I have a new rifle in the mail and I have zero intention of doing any kind of shoot clean shoot break in process. I mean to get some good ammo, sight in, and start trying to get some nice groups. I'll clean it when the accuracy drops off.Quote:
Originally Posted by barbc
rattfink, it WAS a cute video, i will admit, lol
My .243 started shooting 1'' groups or less right out of the box. Just bought it the first of March. An this is with Remington 100grn. core-loc. or Winchester 100grn. soft point. I've only put around 50 rnds. through it. So I don't it has a break in period.
thorshammer, did you clean the bore before you started shooting it out of the box?
Here you go. Though there are many naysayers I'm a believer in breaking in barrels.
http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/p...barrelbreakin/
The only 100% fact you will get about barrel break- in is that there is no proven method. Just alot of speculation.
about 4 years ago there was a long article in the american rifleman on the subject of barrel breakin.
while there are some barrel makers who reccomend it there are others who dont.
arguments can get heated over the subject. over the years ive had lots of friends who are or were
1000 yd competitors at williamsport. a few were record holders. they didnt break in their barrels.
but of coarse there are others who did.
i also have a friend who got upset with me for not taking his (backup) gps with me on a trip
from pa to wy on rt 80 a couple years back.
ive never asked his opinion on this subject. but i have a feeling about what it might be.
That is pretty much what I do with a new barrel. You want to get as much of the firing crud out of your new barrel between shots as you can. Unless your bore has been lapped, it will be rough enough to trap crap until it has been shot/cleaned a few times. It's your barrel....the choice is yours.Quote:
Originally Posted by big honkin jeep
That's pretty good. Make sure you scroll down and read the comments--the epitomy of firearm forum firefights. : )Quote:
Originally Posted by rattfink
Oh yeah, the guy's best material is in the comments :nod:Quote:
Originally Posted by thermaler
Also, Gale McMillan (Yes, that McMillan) has some interesting insight into barrel break in.
I wish I hadn't gone back and read the comments now. Has taken the jest out of it. What is wrong with some people? I might probably try and run my barrel in a little bit different to that...
Tack
any links?Quote:
Originally Posted by rattfink
Someone earlier suggested to google 'Gale McMillan barrel break in'. Worked for me.
Sorry, I'm terrible with technology.
Tack
An amusing troll--I think his main intent was to engage the shocked responders in verbal fisticuffs. Not a wise thing to do in the world of weapons, IMO. I personally try to always make it known that I'm a student/novice and am not an expert--but my strategy is to try to elicit as much useful information as I can. People take for granted these days the likelihood that someone is watching what they do publicly on the net and may record and report to authorities.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tack
Sorry, I'm lazy--thought you might have had a particular article in mind.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tack
This is the article I read. Like all things, I take it with a grain of salt but what he says makes a lot of sense to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by thermaler
http://www.6mmbr.com/gailmcmbreakin.html
Thanks! Read it and the firing line forum conversation. Indeed very interesting. I probably fall into what he would call OCD (obsessive cleaner disorder). For all the opinions flying around--why hasn't anyone simply taken two identical production barrels and tested them--one with a cleaning regimen and one without--in order to do a basis of comparison?Quote:
Originally Posted by rattfink
All very good input everyone! I am leaning towards why put all those rounds through. This is a hunting rifle, I may only have it out a few times a year, and depending on how the deer are on a particular day, might not even get to fire it. Might take it to the range for a few practice sessions, to get my accuracy up (yes, I mean my accuracy, not the firearm, lol). And, as long as I faithfully clean it every time I bring it home, before storing it away, it should last me for many many years. :adoration:
Funny you mention Why you would want to put all those rounds through.
Factory barrels are generally pretty rough. Especially when compared to many of the custom barrels that say they don't need break in. A factory barrel is an entirely different animal than a custom match barrel. I have noticed that my factory barrels seem to gain accuracy as they are shot for the first couple of hundred rounds. Some a little more some a little less. Nothing wrong with cleaning between shots during "practice" and calling it "break in"
Surely it wont hurt.
McMillian obviously knows his stuff--but several things stand out in my mind--especially in the discussion concerning AR's. Most of the rifles and uppers I've purchased arrive pretty dirty with a rather toxic mix of powder residue from factory test shoots and left-over rough edges/metal dust/shavings from uneven polishing/cleaning during manufacture. Often one cleaning is not going to get everything out--as I believe it takes a while to "shake" things out and the various parts to "smooth out" in their inter-operations. But I'm an amateur and I'm just guessing. The other thing that kinda disturbs me is his admission that barrel manufacturers routinely recommended clean-ups or break-ins for the purpose of premature barrel wear-outs so they could sell more. I've had a couple that I could never get to shoot decent sub-MOA groups consistently and that usually soured me on the manufacturer to the point that I would hesitate to by anything else from them.
I will continue to break in barrels as I always have; a thorough cleaning prior to shooting whether new or used then to the range. Then fired and fired and fired, of course allowing time for the barrel to cool, then another thorough cleaning at home, oiled and put away till the next time out.
That's it.
If stirring tea leaves and pouring goat's blood down the barrel makes it shoot better--than by God that's what I'll continue doing as long as I keep getting one-hole groupings. : )
To each his own, but I think you may have to go to Katmandu for that blood thingy there, may be frowned upon in some neighborhoods.:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by thermaler
the ideal of a soft copper jacket being capable of removing a steel burr just doesnt sit with me..
I've heard it suggested that shilen doesnt recommend breaking in a barrel, but honestly he hand laps the barrels, so not much point.
I have a friend who awears by his elaborate break-in procedure and applies it to every new rifle he buys. He's a fine, intelligent fellow and may be right. But there is one question he cannot answer -- how do you know it wouldn't shoot as well if you just ran a patch thru the virgin barrel and then shot the heck out of it any ol' way? Even with 2 identical rifles -- well, each one is unique to begin with, and you can't make a valid comparison, unless it's putting each thru the same course of fire with loads as near-identical as possible and concluding, "A is more accurate than B.". It simply defies objective quantification. Like religion, you either believe, or you don't -- you cannot prove it to anyone in this life.
A respectable scientific trial of "identical" barrels would have to involves too many guns and rounds to be practical for anyone here. The way I see it you would have to shoot the life expectancy worth of bullets through each barrel and probably 30+ barrels of both the control and experimental group. A pricey proposition for anyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by pisgah
So x2 on not being able to prove it either way.
Ponder this...
> Metal-on-metal will always wear both surfaces (and at different rates congruant with their respective hardness).
> If you have NO clear and conclusive answer to a problem, you may not actually have a problem to begin with
> You cannot prove a negative (other than evidence of absence or proof of impossibility - neither apply to this subject)
> If there is no harm, then why not?
Just my 2 cents....
Well JH, I tend to agree. Two more points to further muddy the waters:
1. Did our granddaddies fail to put food on the table with their rifles before anyone ever heard of breaking a barrel in? If not, then what does it fix?
2. The shooting everyone here is talking about is a hobby. So within the confines of safety and good taste, engage your hobby in whatever way makes you happy. At the end of the day, its your rifle, your time and your money. If a break in makes you happy, then shoot clean shoot away.
I'm just going to shoot..shoot...shoot and after shooting..give a good cleaning....thats my break in....I think some people have too much time on their hands...Pred53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator53
Maybe...
My point is that there is nothing conclusive either way. But if it makes you feel better about it - go for it. You can't screw it up by following a break-in procedure...
That's pretty much the conventional wisdom, but consider --Quote:
Originally Posted by jhelmuth
My friend is one who goes through 200 rounds in his full break in, and Lord knows how many cleanings. If nothing else, he is putting 200 rounds of wear on a barrel, and some will say cleaning too much can be harmful. On a regular hunting rifle that doesn't amount to much, but some premium target barrels can have a top-accuracy life of 3000 rounds. Is using up 7% or so of your top-accuracy shots worth it? Maybe to some folks, I guess it is, at least psychologically. Just one of those things I think about when not solving all the world's problems...:biggrin-new:
There is a certain absurdity about this whole argument that bugs me--you're gonna send bullets through a weapon anyway, and you're gonna clean it at some point, all the while the manufacturers themselves say they can't definitively tell you what is really going on because there are too many variables (not the least of which are variations in manufacturing). As far as I can tell, "Break-in" means nothing more than more frequent cleanings/lubrications after you purchase a weapon--until you feel the correct accuracy mojo has been attained, at which point "you do as little as possible to upset that mojo." If scientists can figure out that boson particles do exist--it can't be all that mysterious from a physics point of view whether or not extra cleanings harm or hurt a barrel's bore (assuming, of course, that the barrel is a "perfect virgin" to begin with).My in-expert less-than-two-cents.
IF (your choice) you are going to perform a break-in procedure, here is what I'd do (and have done)...
[1] Keep ALL shots slow-fire with a minimum of 3 mins between shots. This would keep the barrel reasonably cool and minimize throat errosion from excessive heat. Barrels wear more from excessive heat than any other factor.
[2] Double up on your experience by using those rounds (typically 50) to help you identify possible nodes. Load your break-in rounds as if you are going to develop a load for that barrel. That ought to aid in minimizing your load development cycles.
Those are 2 easy and simple things to incorporate into a barrel break-in and would be a MUST for me.
Now if I were to want to avoid a break-in I would buy a hand lapped barrel...
Words of Wisdom from Big Jim H.Quote:
Originally Posted by jhelmuth
And it is worth noting I have never broken in a barrel on a rifle since forever. I don't let them get too hot, but break in procedure is just not in my itinerary. Now I do agree with Jim's last statement.... If there's no harm, why not?
Kinda falls in line with the old saying from the 60's "If it feels good, do it". It couldn't possibly hurt.
Happy Easter, y'all!
one reason would be because barrels are like people no 2 are exactly alike.
it's not uncommon for serious match shooters to buy and chamber several barrels.
then use the best one.
just a few years back having barrels frozen in order to have the molecules properly alligned was all the rage among shooters.
had someone set a new record after having his barrel frozen rest assured it would still be popular.
so would wearing a red beany with a propeller for that matter.
fact is opinions on things are changing constantly. even among the experts.