Printable View
Spent about an hour or so reading other threads and still was wandering about which bullet to try first. I am wanting to make a long range load for target shooting and small whitetail deer hunting. What bullets should I be looking at?
Barrel: Shilen 26" 1:10 twist 308 Win
Stock: BC Medalist A2
Savage 10 Action with AccuTrigger
I have Varget and 8208 XBR powder and CCI 200 primers.
155g hornady a max for long range hunting.
168g sierra matchking for long range target shooting.
for 10 twist I'd go with
178 Amax ........
175 Smk's.......
My 10fp loves 43gr of Win 748 behind a 175 SMK.
For hunting, I like 165gr Hot-Cor's.
I used to get excited about boat-tails for hunting stuff, but honestly don't anymore; Here is why:
Look in your tables, or get your ballistic calc out. For pure drop, the drop doesn't become large(for deer sized game) until the 700 yard range. At that point your bullet is running out of KE anyway. My set-up to be accurate at 1,000 yards is not fun to pack across sections of hills looking for deer. So I change stocks, and don't use a bi-pod. I can accurately off-hand shoot a deer reliably to 200 yards. Beyond that I don't take the shot without a rest... which I don't use for hunting.
Everything depends on WHAT you are after. I hunt with my 308, and shoot to the 1,000 yard line and beyond. But I have no illusions that they are the same thing. CAN you use one bullet for the same purpose? Sure. We all know that you can't be everything to everyone, so which realm do you want the bullet to suffer in? Some manufacturers will tell you you can do double duty(big game/target) with a bullet. But will they tell you which part of that they aren't very good at? Probably not.
Ok that helps. I was trying to get one bullet that I could load long range for target shooting and for deer at or under 300 yards using same bullet. I was just trying to save a few dollars and only have to come up with one load but maybe will be better to stick with the 165 SST for hunting and the heavier for target shooting
Not sure how the BTHP will work on small deer at the above distance
I'm having success with 44.2-44.4 grains of Varget with 178 A Max -.015 jump
I've been told A Max was not recommended for hunting deer?
Is this true?
PSE EVO 57 Lbs.
Blacked out
deerhunter: same question I had about those and the 175 BTHP bullets
I don't understand question?Quote:
Originally Posted by supergolfer18
I have tried 175 SMK very little and they seem to be right there with A max.
Planning to shoot them more this weekend.
SMK ogive oal varies .011 or more!
Don't like that!
PSE EVO 57 Lbs.
Blacked out
I was reffering to them being used for deer hunting
I think you missed my point.
If you want LONG RANGE, get a match bullet. Either a high BC 155, or a 175-class.
If you want to deer hunt, get a hunting bullet.
If shooting 500 yards and under, use a hunting bullet.
SMK's aren't built to expand, they generally pencil through. The small amount of yaw isn't enough for reliable deer kills.
CAN you do it? yes.
darkker: ok got it
Thanks
Target: 1) Berger Target 175 or higher, 2) Sierra Match King same weight
Hunting: 1) Berger Hunting 175 or higher, 2) Sierra Game King same weight
My 2 cents
I have had very good luck with HPBT Sierra Game Kings. They shoot more accurately for me than the Match Kings??? Go figure. I talked to one of the ballisticians at Sierra and he told me that it wasn't that uncommon and some rifles just like the ogive on the Game Kings better.
I would suggest you give em a try.
178 Amax, 43 gr IMR 4064
28" criterion barrel, 1/10 twist
Shot 11 deer with this load in the past few weeks. Only deer that ran were shot in the heart and made it less than 30 yards. Shot 1 deer at 375 yds, 1 at 543 yds and 1 at 630 yds. All dropped in their tracks.
I've shot this load to 1065 yds with very good results.
what primers are y'all using? I have CCI 200 LR primers and am wandering if I need to switch to a BR primer
I'm using Federal Match primers
PSE EVO 57 Lbs.
Blacked out
Cci br.
+1!Quote:
Originally Posted by psharon97
Primers
Federal or CCI match
Target Boolits
Berger 155-175's
Sierra 168-175's
Amax 168-175's
Hunting Boolits (same weight class as above)
Sierra Gamekings (don't overlook the 180 for heavy game)
Nosler Balistic tip (hunting)
Hornady interbond or amax
Powder
R15 - Varget - IMR4895 - 4064
Hope that narrows it down for you.
I don't mean to derail this post.....
Got a question that needs some explaining/clarification... because it's the moral and ethical thing.....
"hafejd30" - Where are you shooting deer in the middle of July?..... Let alone a total of 11?
Your profile says Michigan, the early hunt for Michigan is September..... What's up?
Am I missing a season somewhere?
What he said!!Quote:
Originally Posted by psharon97
-kschilling-
Not sure if Texas is the same but in michigan our DNR issues what are called "crop damage permits" to local farmers who are experiencing damage to their crops. The DNR will assess the damage to the crops and amount of land the farmer has to determine the correct amount of permits to issue. The farmer then develops a list of designated shooters to take the deer.
This is from late june/early july through end of september. Only deer with antlers 3 inches or less (just does in our case if we can help it) are allowed to be taken during normal shooting hours.
We have a significant amount of deer in our area. In fact the DNR changed the law this year to let the farmers go from the previous limit of 3 shooters to adding up to 15 shooters.
FYI for those of you wondering what it does to the population we took 3 from one field last week. The total of deer we saw from that one spot included 11 bucks (4 decent 8 pts), and about 7 does. This is a field we've been shooting for several years.
Now back to the origional topic
anyone using the Hornady 178 BTHP over the Amaxs? They have a much higher BC
havnt tried the BTHP yet. Supposedly the accuracy is neck and neck with the Amax. I chose Amax because my research led me to finding a lot of people who used those for deer as well as targets. I have found they do work well for both. I started with 155 amax, but wanted more range. Then went to 168, now I use 168 in my mid-range build (to 700 yds) and 178 in my long range build.
I know the sierra matchking, which are similar in build to the BTHP's, are not recommended on deer from people that have tried them.
The furthest deer kills with the 168's were 2 deer and a coyote between 630 to 635 yards. This is the first year for the new build with the 178's. There running faster than the 168's do and pack more punch. If you decide to try them go directly to the 178's. Both guns are 1/10 twist and shoot better with the 168 to 178 than they did with the 155's.
I have also shot a bear with the 168's. Shot in the heart lung area and bullet proceeded into the front shoulder. Dropped in its tracks. Only about a 115 yd shot tho.
I have had very good luck with 190 Orange Box Berger hunting bullets in my 10 twist. 43.5 grains Varget, .010 in the lands, CCI large rifle primers! VERY accurate out to 600 yds! I shot 60 rounds at 600 yds hitting the 3" bullseye 21 times! FYI
I know several shooting the same load and one person shooting this load in a 12" twist 28" barrel! Very accurate.
hafejd30 -
Finally clarification!!!!!! Thank you.... Yes, I understand you're problem. I hunt an area of land in Kansas that has the same problem. And No, Texas does not offer that on Whitetail deer. I would've thought there were enough hunters in that area to control the issue..... At any rate..... control the herd!
loaded up the 168 amax using Varget and Fed 210M primers @ 2.240"(ogive) which is a 0.015" jump to lands. Starting charge 43gr and am going to work up in 0.3 to determine max charge. Brass is WW virgin brass
Full length resize before next reloadsQuote:
Originally Posted by supergolfer18
Neck size after that round
PSE EVO 57 Lbs.
Blacked out
Food for though..... My savage and criterion barrel shot better with Amax the further I got from the lands. My savage barrel started out about .020" off and is now .032" off. Same load just barrel wear. It keeps getting better the more it wears down.
I did test the amax- jammed, .005, .010 and .015 off the lands. Closer I got the more they opened up.
My match load in a 12FTR. 42.8 gr H4895, WLR, 175 gr SMK, about .020 jump IIRC. Very accurate. Measure all bullets to ogive, sort them and load.
I know you want one bullet, but if you're doing both long range target shooting and hunting, I recommend 2 bullets... but they're fairly expensive.
175 grain Berger VLD
175 grain Berger VLD (Hunting)
Both the hunting and target bullets have exactly the same profile and BC (.498). You should be able to shoot them interchangeably.