Neck shot vs Body shot

I am starting this to help keep another thread from being over run but it is an interesting subject with both types of shot being both deadly and also having the chance of being non-fatal.

I prefer the body shot (vitals) due to the larger target area to makeup for any mistakes i make and to also help with any movement by the animal in question. With a well built bullet penatration is not a problem as long as common sense is used in choosing when to shoot. I have taken neck shots and belive they have a greater risk of losing the game either by a complete miss or a bad shot altho when properly placed they tend to require no tracking at all. I belive the answer to which shot should be taken returns to a combination of factors such as distance, shooter ability in the prevailing conditions, activity of the animal, surrounding stimuli such as dogs, traffic, other nearby animals, weather....ect.

I don't want this to get into some kind of debate but everyone has little differences on why they choose the shots they take and i belive we can all learn something from each other.

Gary

Will post here too.

I think its a personal choice, and should be based on your skill.

The one guy I was talking about before that is now dead was an army marksman, a WWII guy and shot a 25-06
and only shot deer in the neck for 20 or more years. If he pulled the trigger it went down.

I have seen a lot of crippled deer from bad body shots.
Legs either gone or mamed, with deer limping around.

My 90yo dad has about 80 years of hunting experience and he even saw a buck that had no front legs and had to either scoot around or get up on his back legs. Probably more deer are lost to gut shots where ether it was just a bad shot or the bullet hit a twigs or whatnot and gut shots are nasty.

At any rate no matter what, you should know your gun, ammo, surroundings and capabilities as any good hunter does.

We hunt in 4x4 box stands and have thick rubber pipe insulation on the bottom of the openings. They are set up at just the right height to shoot off of, so its almost like a rest. If a deer is broadside and moderately still and about 100 yards or under I will take a neck shot, but I would not try one off hand or if the circumstances were not ideal like too long distance, quartering away etc.

Hogs to date I shoot in the body, but my cousin goes into the woods with a 22LR and shoots them in the ear.
I call him nuts, but he can really shoot a 22LR.

As far as deer hunting dead is dead if its a clean humane shot but I like it when they just tip over DRT from a neck shot.

To me a deer neck for a target does not seem that small.

I was watching a documentary on inuits in greenland where they were shooting seals with a 17 HMR from a pretty good distance.
Shot them just behind the eye to keep them from going back in the hole. Dropped them DRT.
It was an interesting show, but these guys could really shoot from what I saw on the show.

I have been known to take both shots. I don't really think there is a right or wrong answer. And there certainly isn't a single answer for all scenarios. I think it is a combination of shooter ability, distance, animal positioning, weather, etc... The list could go on for ever. If you can make a clean humane kill then it's a good shot. With deer close enough with good conditions I have even been known to take a head shot. Makes them DRT but if the deer is further away I won't do it.

One thing we have to keep in mind here is it isn't a "body" shot. We were talking about vitals vs neck. A "body" shot is a poor shot. If a person can't hit the vitals they can't hit the neck either. The vitals area is a smaller target than the whole neck. The neck presents a lot more "non vital" area to hit that will wound or not give an immediate kill. I have never seen or heard of any one losing a deer with a heart and or lung shot. I don't know of any one, right off hand any way, that takes neck shots, so I really can't comment on it. I too only take standing shots(the deer) or when they are very slowly moving, but shoot any way I can. Either off hand standing, or supported on a rock or pack, or bi pod, or from a blind. Just depends on what I am hunting and where. As you all, the type of shot vs distance and conditions plays a huge part in pulling the trigger.

The instance tammons talked about in the other thread was a poor choice. 2 "body" hits, but the deer was never recovered, so there would be no way to tell where exactly the shot placement was. Also, bullet tech 25 years ago is nothing near what it is today. I mean no disrespect to him or to the shooter, it is just the facts.

As long as you get good results do what works!

You don't know the whole story.

Nothing wrong with the first shot.
It was in the boiler room/vitals or at least that is where he was aiming.
I would have to guess that he missed the heart but probably hit the lungs, just from his description.
Also odd things can happen and the bullet could have hit a twig etc.
The 2nd was a follow up shot when the animal was running.

Bullet performance was fine 25 years ago although I agree not where it is today but IMO had nothing to do with the loss.

I used that rifle and ammo combo a lot and killed a lot of deer with it.
I just think it was one tough SOB deer and got hit hard and got away from him.
Animals do get lost even with good "body" shots.

Deer are incredibly resilient animal and can take a lot of punishment and this was a big animal.
He probably made it into a thicket on a creek and laid down.

Still we are talking about a man that dropped a 5X elk running at 385 yards with one shot squatted down and shooting off his knee.

I personally saw him drop a running deer in the late 60s, one shot at 200 yards, snap shot too with iron sights.
I was actually amazed that he even hit it, but he was and still is even at 90YO an excellent shot.

A lot of other stories like that.

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Originally Posted by 319

The neck presents a lot more "non vital" area to hit that will wound or not give an immediate kill.

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Where can you shoot a deer in the neck where it is not vital ??
Any solid shot anywhere in the neck from just above the shoulder junction up to the base of the skull will drop them
on the spot.

I started deer hunting again for the first time in over 20 years and my wife went hunting for the first time in her life this season.

Both using my 10FP in 308.

She took a 7-point at 60 yards and I took a doe two weeks later at about the same distance - both neck shots.

As said, it depends on a lot of factors. For both of us, the deer were standing and we shot with the rifle supported.

We have both practiced with my rifle and know both our and my rifles abilities.

Next season my wife will have her own rifle in 308!

Superb, nothing like a wife that hunts !

As said by others, depends on a LOT of factors.

For instance I made a neck shot last year on a nice buck (for Louisiana) at a lasered exact 350 yrds.

Sounds crazy doesn't it? But it was DRT.

Shot from a box stand with an extremely sturdy rest....nearly as good as any bench I've shot off of.

With a rifle that is certainly capable of very sub MOA accuracy.

It was actually a very easy shot to make with this combo.

Would I do it without this type of combo? Absolutely not!

But, when the "stars align", I'll sqeeze the trigger every time.

It won't matter what any one says, we will all do what we are comfortable with.

No matter how many deer we shoot, or how good a shooter we are, things can and do go wrong. Again, no disrespect to tammons or the shooter.

I would love to get a medical explaination as to why people can survive being shot through the neck with any thing from 8mm to .22lr to .45 acp and a lot of times live, but you folks are saying deer almost always die. I am guessing it is mostly due to bullet performance, or just lucky shot placement???

I figured I better add a little to this. I know animals/people have lived through hits to the "vitals" also, I wasn't trying to give the impression that they don't.

No problem.

I would say its probably the massive hydraulic shock and expansion of a hunting bullet from a rifle.

For neck shots I prefer to use a more explosive bullet rather than a deep penetrator.
My last neck shot about one a month ago blew a 3" hole out the opposite side of the neck.
Obviously it was DRT. That was with a 308 and a 208 gr amax.

About 5 years ago I shot a doe in the neck with a 22-250 at about 50 yards with a normal 60
gr hunting bullet. I shot about mid neck and it blew a chunk of the skull off.

One reason I really don't like super velocity magnums is the hydraulic shock is so bad with a body shot it can ruin a lot of meat.

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Originally Posted by tammons

Superb, nothing like a wife that hunts !

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Until she takes over your rifle!

I bought her a Stevens 200 in 7-08 but she doesn't like the way it feels/shoots after carrying my 10FP all season.

Just picked up a 20" 308 varmint contour barrel to put on the Stevens and make it a 10FP.

Where can you shoot a deer in the neck where it is not vital ??


Taking my first deer 48 years ago facing me at 100 yards with and old thirty thrity model 94 was the beginning of a long love affair. A lot of deer later I used that same thirty thirty at age 18 to take my first bull elk. There is a lot of area that is not fatal if you shoot elf and moose sized game in the neck. However if one chooses that correct bullet and knows his or her anatomy the animal will drop instantly. Twenty years ago I built a 338 X 284 and with the Nosler ballistic tips it just flatout hammered deer regardless if it was shot at 400 yards through the boiler room or 50 yards just behind the ear.

That same 180 grain bullet with the same gun was used in Alaska by a friend of mine not knowing anything about that design of that bullet. He shot a 60" bull moose twice one inch apart in the big neck bone behind the ear. Both times the animal slumped and with the second shot the moose stiff legged and tipped against a tree. My friend then shot the moose in the ear. He did an autopsy and found two bullets as flat is a quarter against the neck bone not having broken one piece of bone.

With a 3-6 deer limit and having been in Alaska 35 years I have had an oportunity to take a lot of animals from deer to moose and bear and easily the toughest critter who doesn't care if you shoot it with a 375 H&H is a goat. I shoot goat in the neck period. I shoot Brown bear in the neck period as they too are not impressed by energy charts. Every animal I have put a bullet through the lungs drops nearly instantly. Through the heart they run always. Behind the ear they drop instantly. I will always recommend to someone hunting Brown Bear for the first time to shoot through both front shouldersfirst and break the animal down. It is the largest target and once broke down then kill it.

Neal

You need an Elvin bullet to kill an Elf.

Seriously, I have never run into anybody else but me that had a 338-284.
Great round and a real solid whacker, but I sold my barrel a while back.

Went to africa in august of 2010. "Body" shots to vitals are placed further forward on the animals. The vitals shots are placed directly above the shoulder joint. The PH's made sure we all knew that prior to making any shots. I dont know why, but, it seems the vitals are different on those animals. I took my trusty 30-06 and used 180 gr. Hornady SST. I had read reviews on these bullets that suggested that they often lose their jacket at impact velocities greater than 2500 fps, and that if bullet impacts an animal at that velocity that there is usually no pass through. It was my experience that they were correct. I really didnt care about meat damage (as you cant bring any home) just good kills. Anybody that has been knows that "if they find blood, then you pay for it!" All my shots were on plains game, and all "body shots". Every shot exept one did not have an exit wound, but all kills nonetheless. The only pass through was a 150 yd shot on a zebra that ran about 50 yds before falling dead. All animals did run a little bit after the shot, but all were just as dead. I chose to shoot vitals because it was a safer shot to me when money was on the line, and trust me there was quite a bit of money on the line.

My hunting partner was able to take a giraffe. He was instructed to shoot about 4 inches down the neck below the skull. He was using a borrowed 375 H&H mag. His shot was perfect and sent the very large beast to the ground with one shot. There was no pass through, and a head shot was needed to complete the kill. He was told that a body shot was difficult because of the thickness of the skin. I would never have believed just how thick the skin was until the skinners started the skinning. Wow! must have been 2 inches thick! PH's said usually requires several shots if going to the body, and you really dont want to chase this dude as he can cover some ground. Whole thing had to be dressed right where it fell, as it was too big to put in a truck...except in pieces.

I believe the shot placement is completely up to the shooter as he considers his conditions and his ability coupled with the particular animal being hunted.

Bassman

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Originally Posted by bassman

I believe the shot placement is completely up to the shooter as he considers his conditions and his ability coupled with the particular animal being hunted.

Bassman

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Pretty well sums it up!!!! ;D

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Originally Posted by bassman

...used 180 gr. Hornady SST. I had read reviews on these bullets that suggested that they often lose their jacket at impact velocities greater than 2500 fps, and that if bullet impacts an animal at that velocity that there is usually no pass through. It was my experience that they were correct.
Bassman

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My experience has been a little different with SST's. Granted I was not shooting African big game. I was shooting a 260 Rem (140gr SST) at whitetail deer. Both my deer and my wifes deer had clean pass through's. And both through the vitals. Only my son's deer did it not pass through. Rather it went through the neck, shoulder and nearly half the length of a whitetail deer down the back strap. When I found that bullet the lead and the jacket had separated but just barely and they were found right together in the meat. I haven't weighed the bullet yet but just looking at it I would guess that there was 50% or more weight loss to the bullet. It was not the neat clean mushroom that you see in all the advertisements. I still like the SST's and still have most of a box left to reload so I think I will load up a bunch and just use them as hunting rounds. 3 deer in 3 rounds, can't complain about those results.

I have shot many deer in the neck and many deer behind the shoulder. I prefer a shoulder/lung shot. I actually shot a doe in the neck this year with a ballistic tip and lost it. The doe dropped and when I got down to get her she jumped up and ran off. I believe I shot her through the teaches b/c I could hear it blowing when it for up. First time it ever happened. It will probably bleed out and die but left very little blood and was running very good. Point is there is a very little margin of error with a neck shot. Sure deer will likely run a little with a vital shot but there is more room for error. Don't be too lazy to track one.

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Originally Posted by lomfs24

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bassman

...used 180 gr. Hornady SST. I had read reviews on these bullets that suggested that they often lose their jacket at impact velocities greater than 2500 fps, and that if bullet impacts an animal at that velocity that there is usually no pass through. It was my experience that they were correct.
Bassman

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My experience has been a little different with SST's. Granted I was not shooting African big game. I was shooting a 260 Rem (140gr SST) at whitetail deer. Both my deer and my wifes deer had clean pass through's. And both through the vitals. Only my son's deer did it not pass through. Rather it went through the neck, shoulder and nearly half the length of a whitetail deer down the back strap. When I found that bullet the lead and the jacket had separated but just barely and they were found right together in the meat. I haven't weighed the bullet yet but just looking at it I would guess that there was 50% or more weight loss to the bullet. It was not the neat clean mushroom that you see in all the advertisements. I still like the SST's and still have most of a box left to reload so I think I will load up a bunch and just use them as hunting rounds. 3 deer in 3 rounds, can't complain about those results.

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Bluet diameter must play in a bit here. I have used the 139 sst in my 7mag quite a few times. All shots were made to the boiler room. Even on the ones that were quartering, or crashed bone, all went straight through. In every instance, for the roughly 6" diameter area surrounding the bullet cavity, the flesh was turned to jelly. 100% absolutely devistating.
Though animals shot in the neck and or boiler room can, in isolated instances, get up and leave, I find that if you break both shoulders, you will not track very far.
All in all, the best place to shoot an animal depends on the current conditions. Bullet placment is absolutely critical, no matter where you are aiming.

Sorry I am strong advocate of the vital shot (Lungs heart etc.) Not because I have seen lost animals from which I have as well as body shots. I have seen a lot more wasted meat with neck shots. If successfull with a neck shot it will hit the spine and to often I see it travel down the spine. I love backstraps to much to risk the choice cut of meat.

The shot placement depends on where I am hunting and time of day. My prefered shot is in the high lung area. It doesn't mess up too much meat and cuts down on the chance of clipping the gut. We have a few locations that are gnarly planted pine. If I am hunting here or on the edge of our property, especially near dark, I center on the front shoulder. I may loose a little meat but I will not be tracking deer somewhere I dont want to or loosing an animal. I have taken neck shots but I like the extra margin for error of the shoulder vital area.

I prefer a heart/lung shot. That said, I had to take a neck shot on my buck this year and he totally got blown over backwards. I spotted him at 320 yards on the edge of a clear-cut, and as I was trying to work towards him he was feeding around the back of a stump so I wasn't gaining anything as far as a shot goes. I worked in to just over 200 yards, set up on my shooting stick, and whistled. got him when he looked over the stump at me. I put a LOT of practice in with that rifle, and fealt VERY comfortable with the shot he gave me, but I still prefer the heart/lung shot.

I try to go for neck shots, if I know my rifle I am using then neck shots all the way. I would take any deer out to 300 with my 223 Zombie hunter. This year I used my 6.5x55, why? it's a swede there is no reason needed haha

Neck shots are OK. Head shots are great when you get them with high confidence and there's no trophy in play.
I prefer to hit them high center shoulder.
I will NEVER shoot another deer behind the front shoulder. I'm just not into spending half a day looking for downed game.

A shot placed here will drop a deer in its tracks every time, and very little penetration is needed.
In fact, I have killed a ton of them with 6mm 70 BTHP's.

http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s...1/drawskel.jpg

I used a Ruger 77 in 243 shooting handloads with the Sierra 87 grain BTHP for many years here in Georgia and always took a neck shot causing the deer to DRT. The exit would was always around 3". I shot a 10 point buck at 60 yards using a 16" AR carbine and a 62 grain load. Hit heart/lung area, deer ran 15 yards and piled up, no exit wound but heart and lungs were "hamburger".

It's nice to bust both shoulders and go pick up your animal without looking for it for several hours. I have seen this happen many times with those who are so called rifle target champions at the shooting range, hunting big game in the bush or wilderness areas is a whole different ball game. You often as not do not have 5 minutes to make the shot on a broadside presentation. I have only taking one neck shot in my entire hunting life and that was because it was the only thing showing above the rocks and it had a great set of spirial horns on that 58 inch kudu.