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I'd tell you to look at the Athlon Cronus 4.5-29x56 or wait until march when my razor comes off my comp rifle and is replaced with the Cronus
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I would look at the vortex razor line of scopes.
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Sounds to me like you already have a pretty good handle on your scope needs.
I have a Nightforce NXS 8x32 with a NPR1 reticle on one of my guns, a 338 Cheytac.
I have a Leupold 8.5x25 with a varmit hunter reticle on another, a 30x378.
I personaly could care less which one I'm using, as neither has been the (cause) of any issues.
They both work well enough to get the job done and that's all I care about.
As for zero stop, if you know where your zero is, just a glance at the dial will tell you whether your there or not.
And if not, it shouldn't be any issue to get there.
But they don't have to be an expensive factory version either if you want one.
On a Leupold and probably others, just measure the space below, then remove the turret cap. Shave off a section of a 12 gauge hull, slip it on, then replace the cap.
Color wont really matter all that much. lol
Bruce Baer is a stocking dealer for Nightforce scopes. He will sell you a scope with the factory version which is close to $200, or for about $40 he will install his version.
Mine has his version as does a few hundred others he sold, AND, regardless of opinions it dosent affect the scope warranty.
Send him your caps with a return mailer and he will do them for you.
So at least as to the zero stop issue, even buying a used scope on Ebay isn't a problem.
The new Razor AMG comes in black there Batman.... all kidding aside it's hard to beat the Razor Gen II or AMG for the money and surprisingly the Razor color looks good with just about anything.
http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/2017...ed7c020399.jpg
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So for that price, I think you are a little under budget for the max power you want in a variable.
IMO, you need to be above the $2500 mark to get optics that aren't goofy at that max power range. Otherwise what I've seen is that you amplify a bad sight picture.
My two absolute favorites are:
-Weaver Tactical 3-15x mil/mil FFP Model# 800363. That specific scope is roughly a $700 scope and has remarkably good glass, and locking turrets. Also has a very large adjustment range, roughly 32 mils travel.
- Primary Arms 4-14x FFP Mil/Mil. This one has everything except the zero stop and power. The trick with this one is that it is the current world leader in the "Sleeper" class. It will cost you $230 roughly. We did a sideXside comparison to a the SWFA 3-15HD. It flat embarrased the SWFA in glass quality. Target acquisition to a mile is very easily better, without any hesitation. It isn't as... bright, as the SWFA, but I'll take being able to see my target over that any day. Also has ballanced windage & elevation amounts at around 34 mils. So far it has lasted a nasty(funny) tumble strapped to a 4-wheeler and several trips to AZ on the floorboards. Dials repeatably in my tests, and has over 1,000 rounds of Creed/308 on my oldest one.
Optics in a large way come down to personal preference. As an example, C.A. Many don't notice Chromatic Abberation, or know what it is. Same with being bright, Vs. Clear. This last one ALWAYS gets confused. if you have a dimmer scope, but can accurately see colors or pick-out targets better. The one that you can't do that with, but looks really "Bright" will always get chosen.
You could take a look at Burris II 5x25x50. It has FFP. I have used mine for over7 months now and I do like it. Been going for around $1,150 up to $1,250.
For an ELR build you need to look at the total internal elevation of the scope. You need to be able to dial a lot of elevation. Scopes with less than around 100 MOA shouldn;t even be looked at. That is one thing you have to watch with scopes over around 24x as those 32x+ scopes have limited travel.
Also you don't need all that magnification. I have shot to 2500 yards with a 5.5-22x NF on 17x on MOA sized targets. Could see them just fine.
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Yes it does look good!
http://i.imgur.com/otBCcqd.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/OSt3wzl.jpg
How long have you been running this glass now Rob?
Around 2.5 years. I got my first in June of 2014.
+10000
There is a reason that scopes like this are 1/4 MOA. Dialing 10 MOA is 80 clicks with a 1/8 click.
Also internally a 1/8 MOA scope will have smaller gears, be more susceptible to damage AND getting LOST dialing.
If your ballistic app says to hold 20.3 MOA then you will dial to 20.25 and hold .05 MOA. That's a better solution than a 1/8MOA dial.
this depends on what your doing with the scope....most serious F-class and bench shooters use 1/8MOA...the problem with 1/8MOA scopes for most shooters is that they have very little elevation..thin reticles and a small field of view because of the higher powders most have.
Some target shooters prefer 1/8 minit. For long range casual shooting or hunting most would prefer 1/4 minit.
A minit is always a minit regardless of click value. And if you use the numbers on the dial when dialing it really makes little difference what the click value is. There are simply more clicks between numbers, but putting the dial on a number, or a full rev on the dial will still be the same amount of minits. There could be differences between yesterday and today as for the number of clicks needed anyway, especially with big changes in air temp.
Buy a 1/4 minit scope and go shoot would be my suggestion.
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So you think 1.25" is going to get you center and you can adjust for that.... at 1000yds.... and 2.5" isn't going to get you close enough..... man I must have been doing it wrong all this time....
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Unless shooting short range BR, maybe F-Class, or splitting playing cards with a 22. The only things by I see 1/8th turrets getting you is maybe a better Zero. More than likely at range you'll find yourself needing more than just a click... if I miss low or to the side of a target I always just hold the correct. Maybe if I was trying to shoot Silver Dollars at 1000, but then again by the time you see you he shot placement, reach up and adjust 1 click, the wind has already changed....
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Bushnell Tactical Elite ERS... A lot of people look down their nose at these because it's "Bushnell", but their top end scopes are awesome for the money, and it's dead in your price range.
Exactly. 1/8 MOA aren't needed. At ELR a 1/2 mph wind change will move you more than that 1/8 MOA. It's something that sounds better in theory than in use.
As for the perfect zero, the Razor series and the AMG from Vortex have clickless zeroing so you can get a perfect zero without having to worry about 1/8 MOA clicks. The original 5-20x Razor has 125 MOA of elevation and plenty of power to shoot to 2500 yards and runs around $1699. The 3-18x Razor II can also be had for under $2000 and also has more than enough elevation adjustments.
Yobuck is a f in tard
That has always annoyed me about leupold. You might want to look into the Burris XTR II 5-25x50. I has everything you are looking for, a few reticle options, you can have it in MOA or MIL matching turrets to reticle and be under budget. My .02
SWFA SS 5-20X50HD
https://swfa.com/catalog/product/vie...mm-riflescope/
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If the glass in the Bushnell Tacticals is as good as the glass in the 6500 4 1/2-30X50 you will be hard pressed to find something with better glass. Just yesterday I had a chance to compare my Bushnell 6500 4 1/2-30X50 with a Vortex Razor 5-25X50 outside the store. I found a sign with writing on it hundreds of yards away. I laid the Razor on a sandbag. It took a couple minutes of adjustments to read the words instead of making out a letter or two with it on 5X. No further adjustments helped. I switched to the 6500 with it set on 4 1/2X. Instantly I could read it with ease. So far the only scope to have better glass has been my Nightforce 12-42X56. I have owned three Bushnell 6500 2 1/2-16Xs, one Leupold VX-6 4-24X52, four Swarovski z5 5-25X52s, one Minox 5-25X56, one Nikon Monarch 3 5-20X44, one Weaver V24 6-24X, and probably others I don't remember at the moment. None, including the Bushenll 6500 2 1/2-16 have glass as clear as the 4 1/2-30X except the Nightforce. Also I have compared them with all sorts of brands at the range. All of them are good enough to see 6.5mm bullet holes on cardboard at 400 yards.
One day I had a Bushnell 6500 4 1/2-30X50, a Leupold VX-6 4-24X52, a Minox 5-25X56, and a Swarovski z5 5-25X52 laying on sandbags aimed at a chart 127 yards away. I asked my son-in-law to look through them and tell me which one was best to him. He knelt down and looked through them for a few seconds and said, "This one," indicating the 6500. "No! I want you to adjust them to your eye and take a moment," I pleaded. He did. Then he reiterated, "Yep. It's this one," again indicating the 6500.
The only problem is the OP is looking for an ELR scope. The scopes mentioned have limited internal elevation. The Bushnell 4.5-30 only has 50 MOA total. None will do what he wants. Rifle scopes aren't just telescopes. Yes clear glass is great but being able to see something a little better than with another and not being able to hit it as you can't dial up enough elevation doesn't do the job. The Razor has good glass and I know more than one person who uses it on ELR rifles to shoot a mile plus.
The Bushnell 4.5-30 scope I am looking at Elite Tactical LSR 4.5-30x50 has 35 inches up and the Elite Tactical XRS 4.5-30x50 has 30 Mils up (108 inches) the XRS model is more in line with the OPs price range. The LSR is a SFP and is much less money, but with a 20 moa base it will get me to 1600 yards not counting the mil dots on the Reticle.
The Elite tactical XRS is a different animal than the others mentioned. It does have more internal and could be used as an ELR scope.
The LRS is 35 inches up? You mean MOA? If so that is not a lot. The Razor has 125 MOA of total elevation. A .308 can take 32-42 MOA to get to 1000. What caliber you shooting?
I just checked and the LRS has 35" total elevation which is 17.5 up and 17.5 down. You wouldn't even be able to zero at 100 with a 20 MOA base. You should look for another scope if you plan to shoot to 1600 yards.
http://bushnell.com/tactical/riflesc...x-50mm-mil-dot
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Bushnell lists some of their tactical elites as UP or half of the total and some as Total.
ET4305 is listed as UP or half of total. There is a good review for the ET4305 here:http://www.gunsumerreports.com/revie...actical_p1.php
They found according to the total turret adjustment the ET4305 has 85 inches total, of coarse if you use up total you will not be able to adjust as much for windage, that may be why the ET4305 is listed as only 35 inches Up and not 42.5 inches as they got from total adjustment.
Some of the models such as found here:http://bushnell.com/tactical/riflesc...x-50mm-mil-dot are listed as total 24 mils or 86.4 inches
Even my 30-06 only requires 27" to get it to 1000 yards with the 165 grain bullet I use at 3100 fps out of my Sako Finnbear. It goes subsonic at about 1250 yards 1250 yards requires 41" of coarse these figures are based on published ballistics not actual range results.
The rifle I will set the scope up on is a 6.5 Creedmore which is much flatter shooting.
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If you can shoot the 147 ELD-Ms and get them as fast as I am shooting them in my Creedmoor, 2825fps, then it will be 61.25 MOA to get you to 1600 yards at 60 degrees and sea level. It's 38.5 at 1250. Shooting the 140s at 2850fps you will need 69.3 MOA to 1600 and would be 41.8 MOA at 1250.
Well the OP sure has his work cut out for him dosen't he? lol
Building the gun was the easy part, choosing the proper scope is obviously more difficult.
What is ELR?
Is it as far as you can shoot? Or is it as far as you can accurately shoot?
We hear lots of talk about shooting a mile. But there are never any pics of groups shot at a mile here are there?
Id be willing to place a 4' square target at a mile where I shoot/hunt, and feel safe betting $100 a shot against hitting it on most days with most shooters.
And on some days with any shooter. I might not win every shot, but id win on far more than id lose.
Especially with cartridges of caliber 30 and smaller.
For over 25 years I used a custom actioned 30x378 with a 36" 1.350 barrel.
We use a specific rock ledge to shoot at across a deep valley with a very large stream for testing guns.
A small rock aiming point on top of the ledge is 1480 yards regardless of what rangefinder is used. If the wind is blowing hard we don't even bother shooting there. But on good days, it would take about 145 1/4 minit clicks on the scope to hit the target rock. Some days even 150 clicks.
That was with a 200 gr SMK @ 3500 FPS. Now for the serious BC followers, a 220 SMK took even more clicks, and a 240 SMK was even worse.
Proving, that velocity will in fact trump BC to some point. At 1700 yds, which of coarse is less than a mile, it took 200 clicks for the 200 SMK.
And by that time the others were within roughly the same range of clicks. Mind you now, that is with a 3500 FPS gun, not a 3000 fps gun or even less.
Beyond all that, accuracy from shot to shot could be considered poor, as for shooting at a live target the majority of the time.
Which probably explains why in over 45 years I don't personaly know anyone who has made a 1 mile kill in PA.
And for sure some have been trying.
Id say enjoy the gun for what it is, because no scope will make any of them what it isn't.
Yobuck is a f in tard
Yobuck is a f in tard
Well 1 mile ranges especially in the east would be a very rare thing. Fact is I haven't ever heard of one.
1000 YDS yes, there are some, including 3 within about 75 miles of our camp.
I can shoot to 2 miles from the front yard, and about any distance under that if the leaves are off the trees.
I have a friend who owns a reclaimed strip mine and currently has steel targets starting at 800 and going to a mile.
He could and will ultimately have them to 2000. He also has shooting shacks built on the property, allowing for shooting/hunting in poor weather.
I'm going to flat out tell you the opinions you have are wrong. And that will affect the goals you've set for yourself.
I don't think you have an experience issue. If you had the opportunity to shoot, you would recognize that very quickly.
You will not be shooting accurately, consistently, at the distances you desire with anything less than a 338.
And preferably one that will send a 300 gr bullet at 3000 fps, and more is even better.
And that means BY BY to a Savage action, at least for sane people.
Those aren't my rules by the way, they are simply the rules.
I would be glad to host a group at our place for a fun weekend of rock shooting.
Yobuck is a f in tard
You will have a very good cartridge with the 300 Win Mag.
Enjoy shooting it, because it will be a good performer.
Note what I said about my 30x378. 145/150 clicks at 1480 yards.
200 clicks 220 yards further, which means the tank is empty.
The longer they are in the air, the more problems can develop, it's that simple.
I picked up a 338 LM after selling my 6.5 creedmoor for a one mile shoot some time in the future. Once I start hitting 1000 yards consistently, Then I will be trying the 1 mile shoot!
There used to be a place in Ohio that held 1 mile shoots. Not sure but I think they no longer do it.
Bruce Baer won that a couple of times with I think around a 9" group. Not sure but maybe Joel Russo did also.
Mark King and John Buhay are both very much into the extreme range shooting also. Any of those guys would be able to offer up good information.
Also, several members here have shot in VA at a facility called Bangsteel. It is in or very near Wytheville VA,
which is where I 77 and I 81 cross on a map.
They actually give long range classes there with shooting out to 1 mile.