Help me build a long range rig, PLEASE!

Hey guys,
New to to your community but not shooting.
I am a competitive shooter and am looking to get a little more accustom to long range. What I know is that I have a lot to learn from people that already figured alot of this stuff out.
What I want is an easy to shoot 1000 yrd gun that I can get running with less effort. I have selected the 260 round based on its flat shooting characteristics, bucks wind and extended barrel life. Also I would like to add a gas gun down the road. So already having the ammo dialed in will help with that build.

My main area of competition is 3Gun. I will use this rifle mainly for bonus targets. Usually 2MOA or smaller from 600 to 900 or whatever the match director dreams up. I plan to shoot some PRS matches and will most likely be using a comp on the barrel. I may suppress it from time to time, but the primary function will be comped.

I am planning on putting a 6-24x50 Vortex PST on top. I'm guessing I will need medium rings and some kind of MOA rail. 20? 30?
Here is a slight curve ball. I am left handed, Left eye dominate but want a right handed gun. I will keep my left hand on fire control while I run the bolt with my right hand.
My build so far is planned to be a hog hunter model 11(thanks Twinsen), re-barreled with a 24" or 26" criterion barrel. Either dropped in a McRee chassis or XLR chassis. Or keep it cheap and figure out an adustable cheakweld solution and bottom metal on a bell and carelson tactical medalist stock. (Or HS precision.) I want 10 round AICS mags.

Here is where I need your help! These are all just words to me... I have now heard from guys running chassis that the flex to much and the don't load up the same. So stick with a stock. or 100 other little bits of info that sway people one way or another.

About me; I shoot pistol probably the best. I can describe a 100 things I like about a double stack 1911 over a polymer frame gun. But where the rubber meets the road, I can shoot both with almost the same results. I have a $2000 dollar STI that I feel like I shoot way better than a $500 Glock. The timer doesn't always agree...

One of the things I really like about the Savage platform is I can change the barrel out myself. I feel like I can keep things under control and easily change caliber if I so desire later. I have seen 1/3 MOA out a build similar to what I describe.
Thats all the time for rambling I have for now.
Thanks in advance!

You may be able to use low rings with your Viper PST. I used low (Warne) on my PST ona long action with CBI varmint contour barrel and Weaver 20 moa base. Leupold med prw rings were a little high.

Sounds like a nice build. Please post some pics as it comes together.

Shouldn't need a 20 moa base with a 260. That vortex scope should have more than enough adjustment for 1000 yards plus. Your build sounds good to me if you want a stock that's adjustable you may need to look into a manners.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stomp442

Shouldn't need a 20 moa base with a 260. That vortex scope should have more than enough adjustment for 1000 yards plus. Your build sounds good to me if you want a stock that's adjustable you may need to look into a manners.

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Thanks guys.
That's really the question at the moment. Do I go cheap on the stock and add bottom metal and my own adjustable cheek piece or go with a chassis system.
A few local guys are saying the chassis flex to much. They want me to get a mcmillan A5 or the Manners.
Not sure I'm ready to spend that kinda money on a stock...

I have the XLR Element Chassis and know numerous shooters from local and PRS matches that use chassis systems from a number of manufacturers. The Chassis definitely does not flex and so far I like it better than my Manners T2A, but I'm still getting fully accustom to it. The thing with the Chassis I notice most is that you have to be perfect in your form, Breath, Trigger pull, everything! They seem to teach you your weak points very quickly. I chose to go with the Chassis because I'm tired of bedding and tired of the long wait for quality gunsmith work. I shoot matches on a monthly basis and I am currently gearing up for the PRS match in Albuquerque come April. A 260 is a good choice. You could go with a 6.5 Creedmoor though and have affordable quality factory ammo readily available until you get everything you need to reload the new rig. That's probably where I would start if I was starting all over! I've seen a lot of off the shelf LRP's at monthly matches and a few in the larger matches that shoot pretty well. I ran a M10 in the manners T2A and recently switched to a Shilen DGR in the XLR Element Chassis in a custom 243win chamber.

Most important thing is to fit the rifle to you, so that you can be comfortable in numerous unplanned shooting positions. If you're already struggling with fit before you're put in a high stress competition it's going to be highlighted 10 fold when you start sending rounds down range. Also I currently run a 27" barrel with brake. I'm planning for my next barrel to be 24" or 25" tops. A very small percentage of shots actually require the super high barrel burning velocities that some guys run and if you aren't one of the guys running at the top of the pack then it's probably better to run a good accurate load and get all the practice you can out of a barrel until you become more competitive.

I won a couple monthly matches at the local range then started going to monthly's at a more serious range and got my behind kicked. Mainly by the new unfamiliar obstacles and tighter time limits adding a level of pressure I was unprepared for. PRS type events require an extreme amount of practice and dedication that I thought my Military shooting background would have me better prepared for. Once your in it though, it's addicting! Super talented and extremely nice group of people!

As far as the stock goes, I have a mcree chasis as well as several hs precision and Choate stocks. Mcree is my favorite but also the most expensive. This chasis is solid as any other stock (even with a folding hinge). Choate tactical is my second favorite. Consider the expense of a stock with bottom metal vs a chasis. Certain stocks with the metal will be nearly what a chasis will run you

Thanks guys! I'm looking a rig today, mcree with a shot out 6.5 creedmore. I may buy it and re-barrel. If not I'll start buying new parts.

Their is a really nice .260 up for sale in the classifieds in this forum. You need to be a paid member to view them. It's well worth the money. Buy looking at the steel gong that he posted, i would say it is VERY accurite. And no, i don't know who the seller is.

Quick question,
If I got a chassis that accepts the bottom release, or stock for that matter. Wouldn't a top release action still work?
I would just have an extra hole right?

Zap, Thanks for the heads up. I'm going to check out this local rifle first, but will keep my options open.

I went with a .260 LRP. I mounted a Steiner T5xi 5x25 on it. This thing shoots much better than I can.

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/l...pstqqsjo1a.jpg

I build all my loads, so ammo is not an issue.

Feel free to give us a call if you need any help on the barrel side of things. Jim Briggs over at Northland can help walk you through installation if you need any pointers there.

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Originally Posted by CriterionBarrels

Feel free to give us a call if you need any help on the barrel side of things. Jim Briggs over at Northland can help walk you through installation if you need any pointers there.

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Thanks!
I will be in touch shortly!

When ordering a barrel, I see options, for shank size?
What is that? What would I need for what I'm looking for? Large or small?

Depends on what action you start with. The .260 runs fine from either action size. Talk to Jim at Northland and he will set you on a course of knowledge, enlightenment and little tiny groups. He is a stand up guy and probably has everything you need other than your chassis.

Looks like this local deal is gonna go through. I'll have a McRee chassis and a 110 action tomorrow.
I'll probably be giving Jim a call to talk out some details. For example, I think I want a 24" threaded heavy barrel but I don't see that as an option. Does he do custom orders?
Also will the chamber take Lapua brass? Not sure I'm going to use it, but I'm riding the coat tails of some good shooters here, and if they use it, there has to be a good reason.
So I'm guessing the 110 action is the long action and will need the long shank?
Thanks for your patience guys. I do appreciate it.

A long action does not necessarily need a large shank barrel, and more than likely your long action is a small shank. As was mentioned before, call Jim Briggs (telephone is the only way to get a hold of him really).

I will say that if you are going to run a long action, and plan on reloading, you might also look at the 6.5X55 Swede (regular, or AI). All of the joys of the other 6.5 calibers, but with the benefit of supercheap Lapua brass (probably the cheapest cal the make).

Alright, just picked up the base rifle. Next is to call Jim and get a barrel ordered.

http://i1300.photobucket.com/albums/...psrecistla.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jaggy13

Looks like this local deal is gonna go through. I'll have a McRee chassis and a 110 action tomorrow.
I'll probably be giving Jim a call to talk out some details. For example, I think I want a 24" threaded heavy barrel but I don't see that as an option. Does he do custom orders?
Also will the chamber take Lapua brass? Not sure I'm going to use it, but I'm riding the coat tails of some good shooters here, and if they use it, there has to be a good reason.
So I'm guessing the 110 action is the long action and will need the long shank?
Thanks for your patience guys. I do appreciate it.

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We can do a 24" threaded heavy varmint or bull barrel for you. Jim can take custom orders built to your specs. If you would like me to send you the reamer prints for your cartridge, feel free to shoot me an email at contact@criterionbarrels.com. Please let me know if there is anything else we can do to help out!

-Josh

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CriterionBarrels

We can do a 24" threaded heavy varmint or bull barrel for you. Jim can take custom orders built to your specs. If you would like me to send you the reamer prints for your cartridge, feel free to shoot me an email at contact@criterionbarrels.com. Please let me know if there is anything else we can do to help out!

-Josh

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Email sent!

Looking at my current setup, When I replace the barrel, I'm thinking that a new lug may be in order.
Any value in adding one of these?
http://www.brownells.com/rifle-parts...prod20415.aspx

Also do I need to true the action and barrel nut? any reason to replace the barrel nut too?
Looking at the photo above, it appears that I have a short shank. does that look right?
Thanks for the help guys.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jbjh

A long action does not necessarily need a large shank barrel, and more than likely your long action is a small shank. As was mentioned before, call Jim Briggs (telephone is the only way to get a hold of him really).

I will say that if you are going to run a long action, and plan on reloading, you might also look at the 6.5X55 Swede (regular, or AI). All of the joys of the other 6.5 calibers, but with the benefit of supercheap Lapua brass (probably the cheapest cal the make).

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It ended up being a short action. Thanks for the reply.

When you order your barrel from NSS you can get a machined lug and a nice stainless nut with your barrel. It's one of those things that you may as we'll upgrade since you have the rifle in pieces. Is it a necessity? Probably not, but you have come this far to build a tack driver so why not?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Boudin

When you order your barrel from NSS you can get a machined lug and a nice stainless nut with your barrel. It's one of those things that you may as we'll upgrade since you have the rifle in pieces. Is it a necessity? Probably not, but you have come this far to build a tack driver so why not?

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That was my thought as well.
Thanks.
Any help on the shank size based on my picture above?
Or if I replace the lug and nut does it even matter anymore?

http://www.savageshooters.com/conten...el-Shank-Sizes

Pretty sure that's a small, but the above link will help you determine with 100% accuracy.

alright, if I use Lapua brass and a 140grn bullet what dies should I use?
I'm looking at the redding Type S neck die.
If I get a neck sizing die, what bushing would I need?
That's the tuff part about ordering everything at once...

So, got the barrel ordered... 16 weeks. not too excited about that. but it is what it is.
I'm going with a standard 260 chamber to fit the lapua brass and shorter OAL because of magazines.
24: length threaded for a break.
I'm hoping this provides the accuracy I want to achieve while having the shorter OAL.
I choose a redding type S die with a bushing for .293 neck sizing. This appears to be the correct size for the combo I have.
went with a separate body only die and forster comp seating die.
My optic is back-ordered too, Viper PST 6-24. So now we play the waiting game...

Site sponsor Camera Land has the Viper in stock, if you don't wanna wait.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jaggy13

So, got the barrel ordered... 16 weeks. not too excited about that. but it is what it is.
I'm going with a standard 260 chamber to fit the lapua brass and shorter OAL because of magazines.
24: length threaded for a break.
I'm hoping this provides the accuracy I want to achieve while having the shorter OAL.
I choose a redding type S die with a bushing for .293 neck sizing. This appears to be the correct size for the combo I have.
went with a separate body only die and forster comp seating die.
My optic is back-ordered too, Viper PST 6-24. So now we play the waiting game...

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260 lapua brass runs .014-.015 neck thickness so lets say your brass is on the thick side...015...that would be .030+.264=.294 so with your .293 bushing your only going to have .001 neck tension....not enough IMHO after you factor in spring back. ive had my best results using .002 to .003 neck tension so if i was you i would order .292 .291 .290 bushings as well...or better yet just get a lee collet neck sizing die and a few extra mandrels and polish the mandrels down to the appropriate sizes. the reason i say this is because unless you ordered a tight neck chamber for your 260 a fired neck is going to be about .297 .298 so youll be sizing down any where from .005 to .008 and the bushing may cause doughnuts...it did in my nosler brass and my lapua brass...i just started using the LCD and will most likely never use my bushing dies again.

Hotolds, thanks. I'm trying to keep as much local as I can.

Good to know LongRange. I was wondering about that as well.
Looking all the reamer prints I have seen so far, I haven't seen anything with a tighter neck that .297. So I was a little confused about it too.
I'm assuming you would want about .001 maybe .002 in the chamber for clearance.
The bushing I went with was recommended by many, but I will certainly be ready to try different sizes if needed.
Thanks for the post!

Barrel finally came in.
Working on load development now.
Looking forward to getting out and running this thing on some long range steel.

http://i1300.photobucket.com/albums/...ps2unzbwrg.jpg


http://i1300.photobucket.com/albums/...ps78fijszg.jpg

Outstanding, great looking stick

Scope just went back to Vortex. It was not holding zero durring recoil. I was loosing a 1/10 or 2 of elevation per shot and some windage. It wasn't consistent enough to predict it. And I chased it a bit thinking it was just harmonics. I would start to shoot a half inch group then erratically throw a flier high or low. I borrowed a scope to test against and finally got to see a <1/2 MOA group.
Now I can work up a load and get crackin!

So far my loading has worked out well. I'm using the lapua brass with a .293 Bushing neck die. I have 200 pieces that I have fired once now. I'm truing the primer pockets and will probably anneal after another firing.

I created a test round by cutting the neck on a piece of brass vertically. So that a bullet can slide in and out. It's tight enough that I can barely pull the bullet out with my hand. I drop it in the chamber then close the bolt and remove. Now I can take that to the Forster seating die and set the exact length off the lands. The Forster die seems to be fairly accurate. The micro dial is nice too. I have tried 3 different bullet profiles. I've taken notes in my notebook for each COAL to the lands using the test round.

I'm planning on doing some more recon on an accuracy node now that I have working glass. I'll post some more pics when I get some data soon.

I forgot to post my build experience.
I purchased the tools and a barrel nut/ accuracy lug from NSS.
My criterion barrel took a while, so I ordered an Appachie Gun works as well.
I started with the action wrench and installed in a vice.
Started the barrel into the action and then closed the bolt on a .243 go gauge. (Speced by forster)
Screwed the barrel in until it hit a hard stop on the go gauge.
Tightened the barrel nut with the wrench and tightened to 40 foot pounds.
I tested with the go gauge and then a piece of new lappua brass after everything was tight.
With the correct tools, this felt idiot proof.
I then took the go gauge to my reloading press and use it to measure on a Hornady headspace gauge to set my headspace on full length sizing.
Although recommended to size the new brass the first time, I was pleased to measure them and find they were all perfect when using this method.

To anyone wanting to build their first performance rifle, do yourself a favor and spend the extra upfront or borrow the correct tools. If nothing else, it build confidence when firing that first round.

So what went on with that scope??? I bought my Viper PST FFP 4-16x50 a while back and so I guess I better get my build done before I find out its bad too!

Definetly right on the correct tools part. I hope you used Moly lube or something on that barrel. Its not coming back off otherwise...or maybe it will and that just applys with SS barrel on SS action. :)

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Originally Posted by lrshooting

So what went on with that scope??? I bought my Viper PST FFP 4-16x50 a while back and so I guess I better get my build done before I find out its bad too!

Definetly right on the correct tools part. I hope you used Moly lube or something on that barrel. Its not coming back off otherwise...or maybe it will and that just applys with SS barrel on SS action. :)

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Vortex took great care of me. We found a faulty tube was the issue and they replaced it as quickly as possible.
Issues can happen, no matter the manufacturer. It's what happens after the issue that defines character.
I don't think any other manufacturer could have done any better. So for that I am thankful.
I finally have a load dialed in, 139grn scenars over 42 grains H4350 in Lapua brass.
Once I shoot some groups, I'll post up some pics. So far my best is about 1/3" at 100 yards and .75" at 300.
I'm looking forward to some long range action to see how she fairs.

Were sorry you lost the race due to our faulty tires. To show how serious we are were going to give you a whole new set for the next race.
And if those fail we will stand behind them also. Maybe its just me, but i just dont get that logic.

Got to take this thing out to a PRS Match this week end and it was incredible!
Any time I had my sights where they were supposed to be, I got my hits. There were some challenging shooting positions and time constraints that kept me a little humble...
But the rifle performed better than I had ever hoped. I have been shooting competition with pistol carbine and shotgun for a while. It seems like I always have some gun issues to work out before it proves to be reliable.
I did learn a valuable lesson about trigger being set too light. Trying to engage a spinner, I was slamming the bolt home and locking out the trigger. (I guess it's a feature of the accutrigger to prevent ND's) So now I have that adjusted and besides forgetting to dial my DOPE I have nothing else that could have prevented getting my hits.

yobuck, I guess I don't quite understand your point of view either. If my steak isn't cooked correctly I am certainly not going to through a tantrum and demand that someone fix it right away.
I would be as respectful and polite as possible and if they didn't jump at the chance to resolve my issue I would keep my trap shut and just not return.

In regards to my scope issue, I approached in a similar fashion. My intention was not to slander or impune the reputation of vortex but rather give them the opportunity to make things right.
I have first hand knowledge of Leupold mark 4 optics as well as US optics having similar issues. So to expect perfection while admirable is not realistic. It is my humble opinion that it is how someone acts in a crisis is what defines him. My statements about Vortex were geared toward my satisfaction with their action.

Now to complain about the product choice? I believe I am still out of options for the criteria I wanted and the price point I get with this optic. My next best choice to stay with a Horus style reticent is 150% the price to start and over 200% in many cases. and Bushnell on top of that. Nothing against Bushnell but I doubt I would get the same customer service experience, not to mention better. Again nothing against Bushnell. I have actually used their customer service before and everything was adequate.

Now don't for a second thing I wasn't disappointed or even upset. But me crying over spilled milk was not worth the time. Regardless of who spilled the milk, Vortex was never pointing a finger or even insinuating that it was my fault. They just wanted to fix the issue.

I could also talk about my negative experience with Jim at NSS. but I'm not sure what good it would do, and I will most likely order another barrel from him. So just complaining for the sake of hearing my head rattle is not a top priority of mine.
So to summarize, I don't really think complaining to everyone about Vortex's product line would have solved anything. I really don't have another option in that price point so I feel like it is worth the effort to see it though. You may have other feelings and are entitled to them.

To everyone here, I thank you for the assist over the last few months. This has been a very positive experience. I promise to get some groups posted.

Well try to see my point of view. Its not a question about somebody taking the steak back and making it right.
Anyway tomorrow or next month you can go get another steak. If you have an equiptment failure at your weekend shoot well
theres 51 more weekends this year. My bag isnt going to a range with my homebrew gun seeing how small a group i can get.
I have 2 weeks out of an entire year to do what i like to do. I have no control over what mother nature decides to do within
that 2 week season. I have no control over other things that might affect my missing an entire season thereby forcing me to wait for another
whole year to do what i own guns for. I also have no control over wether i will even see an animal to shoot at during the time i have to hunt or if so, will it be within range.
What i do have control over is the equiptment i use. Some nice guy telling me he will stand behind a scope that just failed me wont cut it for me.
If it does for you well thats fine, we all have our own way of dealing with things.

So what is your point exactly yo? Do you have a anti-Vortex post somewhere he didn't read. There are a lot of guns out there with Vortex glass on them. Mine has Leupold and recently found it's turrets are'nt calibrated well. Am I sending it back now? No. It's good enough for this hunting season, but I will call and see what their answer will be. I never received a single email back from Burris about a faulty set of mounts. Never using them again. I think the OP has a great point, let the company decide its fate with the response.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 2scars

So what is your point exactly yo? Do you have a anti-Vortex post somewhere he didn't read. There are a lot of guns out there with Vortex glass on them. Mine has Leupold and recently found it's turrets are'nt calibrated well. Am I sending it back now? No. It's good enough for this hunting season, but I will call and see what their answer will be. I never received a single email back from Burris about a faulty set of mounts. Never using them again. I think the OP has a great point, let the company decide its fate with the response.

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Yes i have made my feelings about Vortex known here on several occaisions actually. Admittedly they appear to be a very nice scope
with all the bells and whistles of far more expensive brands. Which is why my son bought one.
But the experience has shown thats where the comparison stops.
They (might) be ok on guns with less recoil than the 338x378 this particular scope was used on. But weve not had similar issues with others
including Leupold. Id never owned or needed an inch pound torx driver untill we got this scope. And id never heard about using 2 sets of rings
untill we got this scope. And in my many many years of using scopes id never needed to talk with a factory rep in order to just bore site a scope.
Which led to the purchase of the torx driver by the way. The new normal isnt normal unless we allow ourselves to be convinced that it is.
Its junk, in my opinion at least for our needs. But apperently others feel a lack of quality is fine as long as the warrenty is good. Or the server acts sincere and appoligetic.

My Razor 5-20x50 has been great to me. Tracks with my Dope to the .1 Mil. Been on a number of rifles, has been dropped here and there and worked hard in competitions. Still functions like the day I got it. I'd love a GEN II 4.5-27x56 if I could find one!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by yobuck

Were sorry you lost the race due to our faulty tires. To show how serious we are were going to give you a whole new set for the next race.
And if those fail we will stand behind them also. Maybe its just me, but i just dont get that logic.

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Several of us continue to assert the gambling nature of buying overpriced Chinese optics named Vortex. You might win you might not = gambling.

Due to the agreement in the TPP, my comments have enabled China's Vortex Optics to sue the American taxpayer for millions of dollars for lost revenue.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Robinhood

Several of us continue to assert the gambling nature of buying overpriced Chinese optics named Vortex. You might win you might not = gambling.

Due to the agreement in the TPP, my comments have enabled China's Vortex Optics to sue the American taxpayer for millions of dollars for lost revenue.

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Thats a whole nuther subject which could probably lead to me getting kicked off this site.
But id be handing them an iou explaining that id rather owe it than just plain screw them out of it.

.

Alright guys, I'm at 800 rounds down range and everything is really coming together. I just pushed my scope a little further forward and got rid of some parallax I was chasing.
I decided to upgrade my trigger as well. The accutrigger just isn't reliable as light as I would like to go. The rifle shot a solid 1/3" group at about 100m including the cold bore.
Once I get the trigger installed I'll make it a priority to post up some groups. (Basix Sav-2)

This has been an incredible learning experience and I really appreciate all the support and comments.

100 yards with a cold bore shot 1" circle dot.
http://i1300.photobucket.com/albums/...ps1qhvihhs.jpg

300 yard with a cold bore
http://i1300.photobucket.com/albums/...psmgvo9pqi.jpg

300 yard about 5 minutes after the above group.
http://i1300.photobucket.com/albums/...psbguhcrn5.jpg

I wanted to get out to 550 yards but there was a bit of fog. Visibility was fairly poor.
I'm still getting a little bit of parallax, so I am going to borrow a leupold Mark 6 tomorrow and try some more groups. We shall see how it works out.

I'm currently at 900 rounds and shot another PRS match last week end. This thing hit everything. In fact the only targets I missed where because I had slung up to walk stage to stage and didn't check my windage knob before starting a stage... It had moved almost 2 mils. I'm not sure what other rookie mistakes I have yet to learn, but excited to get them crossed off the list!

Another limitation I had with my Vortex PST was at 900 yards, I could see the target very well, got my hits, but could not call hits for myself or other shooters. The plate was swinging but to me it appeared to be stationary. I'm starting to get the bug for better glass... We shall see how that plays out.

Scope, I personally have a March I am going to sell. If interested, PM your email and I will send pic's and spec's.

Dennis

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CriterionBarrels

Feel free to give us a call if you need any help on the barrel side of things. Jim Briggs over at Northland can help walk you through installation if you need any pointers there.

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Jim definately knows his stuff; Northland was great with me. Looks like your build turned out a success

***Disclaimer. My intent with this thread was to glean correct information, document the build process for others in my position and document and report on the performance. Hopefully for the next guy that finds himself in the position I was in.

My intent is not to bad mouth any vendor or sell equipment or product for any said vendor or private party.

This thread had been smatteted with comments taking away from my original intent.
Any build choices I have documented have been based on my opinion and I have made every attempt not to deminish other products or vendors.

Please keep this in mind when replying. I understand you may have a pet vendor or a scope your fond of. But please do not try to sell it here. It is not the appropriate place.
MODS, if I have overstepped my place, please see fit to modify this thread anyway you see fit.
Thank you for the opportunity.

At 1200 rounds down range. I just change to a bushnell XRS 4.5-30x50 optic. It has a 34mm tube and seems to be very bright and crisp. I have been playing with some extended range targets, 6" colt speed plate at 1200 yards was fun. I could easily see the dirt kick up on misses as well as the steel target move when impacted.

I'm looking forward to some more groups to see how it performs. I'll post up again when I have some more data. The season is just getting going, so once the nice weather hits, I'm sure I will have tons to update.