Good Mil based system with Horus or at least subtends

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05-01-2015, 01:04 AM
Lorenzo

Good Mil based system with Horus or at least subtends

Hey Ive been lurking on here for awhile. Been shooting since I was a kid but only bought my first gun about a year ago. Savage 9317TR. Been getting into precision shooting a lot (at least doing my best to educate myself) I bought a Ncstar MKIII mil dot 6x24x50 for my savage. I realize this is a very cheap scope but it holds zero and is clear enough out to 400 yards (max range I shoot with this gun). I am going to be picking up 2 more bolt guns in the future. A savage mkII FVSR so I can have a nice little suppressed .22 and a savage hog hunter in most likely .308 (eventually throwing it in a chassis system maybe MDT LSS). I want to get a nicer mil based scope that I can use for most precision bolt gun applications. I want a mil based reticule and turrets but something more than just your standard army mil dot. Ideally something with some sort of Horus reticule. I want to do this without breaking the bank, lets be honest I'm 25 and don't make that much. I do realize the value in spending the cash to have nice glass. I'd like to just get one scope to use on the .17 and .308 so I can put the Ncstar on the .22. Something with a max mag of around 20, an obj. of around 44-50, mil horus reticule and mil turrets for a decent price. Does such a scope exist? I simply don't have Schmit and Bender, Nightforce, etc money. Also I shoot most of the time prone off a bipod but also shoot off folding tables and occasionally go up to the mountains and shoot of shooing sticks or whatever odd position I need to take.
05-01-2015, 02:54 AM
upSLIDEdown

You really need to be specific on your definition of a "decent price" is. For what it's worth, I love my Vortex Viper PST with the EBR-2C reticle. It's a christmas tree type reticle like you're looking for. You can probably get in one for between $850 and 900 I think, for the 6-24x FFP. I think the 4-16x is less, and the second focal planes are less too.
05-01-2015, 07:11 PM
Lorenzo

Well the cheaper the better honestly. The more it is the longer I'll have to save which is fine, I definitely see that you get what you pay for. The more I look around the more Vortex seems like the way I'm going to go. I gotta keep it under 1,000, Honestly around 6 would be excellent and I am thinking about sacrificing some magnification. Ill have to shoot some guns with some lower than 20 power scopes. FFP makes the most sense to me but I dunno if I shoot on full power 90% of the time I guess a SFP would be fine.
05-01-2015, 08:23 PM
Palmetto-Pride

Quote:

Something with a max mag of around 20, an obj. of around 44-50, mil horus reticule and mil turrets for a decent price. Does such a scope exist?

I don't think you are going to find any scope with a Horus reticle for what you consider a decent price. The cheapest scope I found with a Horus reticle is around $500 https://www.horusvision.com/hunter.php
05-01-2015, 08:56 PM
darkker

Look at Primary Arms, If the FFP mil/mil alone doesn't float your boat; look at their new ACCS(?) reticle system.
05-01-2015, 10:01 PM
Lorenzo

cool thanks for the replies. 500$ would be fine with me, just wanna keep it under 1,000
05-02-2015, 01:25 AM
upSLIDEdown

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorenzo

Well the cheaper the better honestly. The more it is the longer I'll have to save which is fine, I definitely see that you get what you pay for. The more I look around the more Vortex seems like the way I'm going to go. I gotta keep it under 1,000, Honestly around 6 would be excellent and I am thinking about sacrificing some magnification. Ill have to shoot some guns with some lower than 20 power scopes. FFP makes the most sense to me but I dunno if I shoot on full power 90% of the time I guess a SFP would be fine.

Depends on what kind of shooting you're going to do I guess. I shoot mostly long range stuff, but I shot a long range match this past weekend that had a barricade stage with targets as close as 255 yds. I had to dial down to about 10x to have a decent field of view, or I'd have been hunting all day for targets. This stage was also a 'No Dialing' stage, so I couldn't touch my turrets. FFP made it a breeze. Otherwise, I usually shoot on full power though.
05-11-2015, 02:59 AM
bani

vortex viper pst with ebr-2c is what you want. it's an excellent reticle with horus-style marking but not nearly as cluttered. imo it's superior to the horus.
05-11-2015, 09:26 AM
yobuck

Quote:

Originally Posted by upSLIDEdown

Depends on what kind of shooting you're going to do I guess. I shoot mostly long range stuff, but I shot a long range match this past weekend that had a barricade stage with targets as close as 255 yds. I had to dial down to about 10x to have a decent field of view, or I'd have been hunting all day for targets. This stage was also a 'No Dialing' stage, so I couldn't touch my turrets. FFP made it a breeze. Otherwise, I usually shoot on full power though.

FFP made it a breeze for you for what reason?
Im just assuming its because you (prefer) the reticle size to remain constant thruout the power range?
Would there be other reasons?
05-11-2015, 10:37 AM
Newsshooter

Quote:

Originally Posted by bani

vortex viper pst with ebr-2c is what you want. it's an excellent reticle with horus-style marking but not nearly as cluttered. imo it's superior to the horus.

Only problem with the PST is that it doesn't focus close enough for me on a .17HMR or .22.
05-11-2015, 10:58 AM
darkker

Quote:

Originally Posted by yobuck

FFP made it a breeze for you for what reason?
Im just assuming its because you (prefer) the reticle size to remain constant thruout the power range?

SFP keeps the reticle size constant. FFP has the reticle grow & Shrink with magnification changes; what is constant is the distance between the subtensions, regardless of it's apparent "size".
05-11-2015, 11:00 AM
Newsshooter

Quote:

Originally Posted by yobuck

FFP made it a breeze for you for what reason?
Im just assuming its because you (prefer) the reticle size to remain constant thruout the power range?
Would there be other reasons?

Because the reticle is accurate no matter where your magnification is set. I have a SFP PST and the reticle measurement is accurate at 24X, now if I need to dial down to 12X, such as noted for a better field of view, my measurements are now doubled, with an FFP scope it is always the same, no calculations needed. So with the SFP scope I have to calculate for the change in distance when using holdover or holdunder using the reticle. For an easy example, I'm zero'd at 100 yards, 200 yards is .6 mils, 300 yards is 1.4 mils, 400 yards is 2.4 mils, 500 yards is 3.4 and 600 yards is 4.6 mils. If I have three targets to shoot for the stage, one at 100, one at 300 and one at 600 and usually it would be 300, 100, 600 just to make it more interesting. :) Using the reticle and an FFP scope I'd dial for 300 and hold under 1.4 for the 100 yard target, and hold over 3.2 for the 600.

Now for the SFP scope mentioned above in the same scenario at 12X I'd dial for 300 and then since the reticle measurements have doubled I'd have to hold at 1.4/2 or .7 mils and 3.2/2 or 1.6 mils . Easy enough to do when you have time to figure it out. Not as easy when you have 60 seconds to put two rounds on each target in 60 seconds. And then if you do this regularly you know your dope for the distances mentioned but now you are calculating it due to the changes in magnification. At 18X it is .5, any idea what it is at 10X? :)
05-11-2015, 03:32 PM
CharlieNC

What size targets? Big difference if you want F-class vs steel, but I get the impression you are not shooting the small stuff like 0.5 MOA at long range. On this basis a $300 SWAFA fixed power like the 12X is all you need for 1000 yard steel; a young fellow just won the recent 308 class match at Bang Steel (out to 1035 yards) with that scope on a Savage. I recently got a Sightron SIII 6-24 FFP that is really nice for $800, and I think the SFP version is closer to $650; these get great reviews and so far I'm very pleased with the performance.
05-12-2015, 01:14 AM
upSLIDEdown

Hah, random to see someone here post about Bangsteel. Charlie, were you there that day? I was. :)
06-18-2015, 04:41 AM
bani

Quote:

Originally Posted by Newsshooter

Only problem with the PST is that it doesn't focus close enough for me on a .17HMR or .22.

how close do you want to shoot? i can focus at 15 yards or so with my PST. did it this weekend on a 30-06. yes, i too was suprised it would focus that close.

fwiw the pst parallax adjustment goes down to 50.
06-18-2015, 10:29 AM
Newsshooter

My 6-24 Viper PST focuses just inside 50 yards at higher power, if I dial down it is sharper closer, only the low end scopes focus close and they don't offer the type of reticle he's looking for in a scope. I'm told the razor will focus closer as well.
06-18-2015, 12:59 PM
bani

Quote:

Originally Posted by Newsshooter

My 6-24 Viper PST focuses just inside 50 yards at higher power, if I dial down it is sharper closer, only the low end scopes focus close and they don't offer the type of reticle he's looking for in a scope. I'm told the razor will focus closer as well.

as i mentioned before, the ebr-2c will meet all his requirements in a reticle.
06-18-2015, 03:56 PM
Newsshooter

The EBR-2c is a nice reticle, I'll have one in a Razor if it ever gets here, but I don't believe the PST will focus down to 15 yards even at 6x at least my Viper PST 6-24 won't focus that close.
06-18-2015, 10:59 PM
bani

Quote:

Originally Posted by Newsshooter

The EBR-2c is a nice reticle, I'll have one in a Razor if it ever gets here, but I don't believe the PST will focus down to 15 yards even at 6x at least my Viper PST 6-24 won't focus that close.

mine did this past weekend. like i said i was suprised. brought the 30-06 with pst into an indoor range just to show to someone. pointed it down at the berm at 15 yards and ****, it was in focus...

just to verify i wasn't full of crap... i just tested mine. i can just focus on the front doorknob from my bedroom at 6x. and that is 12 yards.

i suspect it will be perfectly fine for 22lr unless he's shooting scoped at 10 yards or something.