Headspace and resizing issue, help me make sure I am doing the right thing....

I built a 7mm Rem SAUM off my Savage action, using a Shilen barrel. I did not have go/no-go gauges, but did have 200 rds of Remington unfired brass. The unfired headspace of the brass was very consistent, as measured with my Hornady Lock-n-Load headspace measure.

I headspaced the gun using the unfired brass, with one layer of scotch tape for a "go" gauge, and 2 layers for no-go.

I sorted the brass by weight and have been resizing it before the first firing. Weight based lots. The resizing consisted of neck sizing, it seems, as I was not able to push the virgin brass shoulder back any.

Now, after firing, I measured the headspace of the fired brass. Its at most a couple thou over the unfired brass.

When I try and full length resize and back the shoulder back a couple of thousands, I cannot. The resizing die hits the case holder of my Forster Coaxial press before the case is sized back any.

When I chamber the resized rounds (essentially neck sized), they chamber, but with a little resistance. Not bad, but its a hunting gun.

So.....

I assume I have set the headspace very tight on my build. This seems to result in my inability to resize fired brass back to a small enough case to allow for easy chambering. Of course, in an autoloader, one would purchase small base dies....

But I am thinking I should actually screw the barrel out a couple thousands to increase the headspace a tad. That would allow my fired brass to chamber fine, and next loading, I will be able to use the standard dies to push the shoulder back a couple thou.

Is that logic good?

Please don't lecture on getting go/no-go.

How much of a turn of the barrel should I aim for to move the headspace out .005"???

Thanks in advance....

If you cannot bump the shoulder back .002", you need to either try a convention press that uses shellholders, or trim the bottom of your resize die. That's why I always mate a shellholder to the sizing die. It should bottom out on the die and prevent from bumping the shoulder too much. Different brands of shellholders can be thinner or thicker, the nominal depth should be .125". It may be necessary to mate a thin shellholder to your particular die to get the correct bump. I have a few dies that were over .020" short, and I welded 3 small spots on top of the shellholder and ground them to the correct height to get no more than .002" shoulder bump when it bottomed out.

I would increase the headspace by .003.

It's no coincidence that you're the second one this week who has set his headspace to brass and had problems.

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Originally Posted by stangfish

I would increase the headspace by .003.

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OK, did some math. Savage barrels are 20 TPI. That equates to 50 thou per turn. 1/16 of a turn is 3.125. So I will divide my barrel, roughly, into 16ths, and turn it out 1/16th of a turn.

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Originally Posted by Hotolds442

It's no coincidence that you're the second one this week who has set his headspace to brass and had problems.

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I would argue that I have not had any real "problems". Excessive headspace causes REAL problems. My "problem" is that I cannot size the brass properly. You are right that setting the headspace off brass is not something that a complete novice should try. On the other hand, the whole allure of the "brotherhood of the barrel nut" is that the Savage action allows for headspacing based on the nut and a spacer of some sort, as opposed to expensive machining of the barrel tang.

Sharpshooter points the absolutely correct approach I suspect. But I don't have the equipment to grind the die down in a precise manner, and the Forster Coax does not use shell holders anyhow. I have another press, but its a hassle to use as I have only enough bench space to bolt on one at a time....

Thanks so far....

Quote:

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OK, did some math. Savage barrels are 20 TPI. That equates to 50 thou per turn. 1/16 of a turn is 3.125. So I will divide my barrel, roughly, into 16ths, and turn it out 1/16th of a turn.

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Correct. .050 per revolution. If you have a splined barrel nut make a mark lined up with one spline on the barrel back the barrel out one half of a spline. You could also add a piece of notebook paper behind the case. Most thin printer or notebook paper is about .0035.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hotolds442

It's no coincidence that you're the second one this week who has set his headspace to brass and had problems.

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The problem people run into doing this is using unfired or new (whichever they want to call it) to set headspace. Fired brass sized in your die will give you perfect head space for YOUR reloads but may be wrong for factory ammo. New brass has to be able to fit in any chamber within the manufacturers specs so most factory brass and ammo is on the small side giving you excessively tight headspace and most times out of spec on the tight side when used to set headspace.
I may be repeating my self but i type faster than i think.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by stangfish

I would increase the headspace by .003.

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I would agree with this. I had problems with my 6.5-284. Some of the problem was the press and some was the die. With the barrel nut you can change the size of the die easier by changing the size of the chamber length. When you re-size your cases make sure you measure your case right and don't bump the shoulder back to far so that you don't over work the brass. I would say that care should be taken when shooting other brass that has not been annealed and ran through another die. If this is not a good approach then somebody speak up and call B.S. as I wouldn't want anyone to get hurt!

Well, I set the barrel out .004 or so, about 1/16 of a turn. we shall see....

Amazing part was that I hard torque the barrel nut last year with a torque wrench to about 100 fts lbs, but not excessive....

It was a bugger to get loose. Far harder than the original factory build was. Kind of surprised me.....

No need for 100 lb/ft or torque, 30 or so will be more than adaquate. Also remember to account for your added length and adjust torque setting as needed on wrench. Really just snugging it up good by hand will serve you just fine.

I like the 30ft/lbs rule or a smack with a mallet. I've seen accuracy issues with Barrel nuts not tight enough.

40 lbs of torque has always worked well for me, and I use a "dab" of Antisieze on the threads. ;-)