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new guy here looking for few answers on a possible trade im maybe doing. haven't had much experience with savages so need some input. im looking at a savage model 10 FP LE 2A. did these all come with chaote stocks? its in 308. was tod these arnt made anymore? are they good rifles? any issues?
whats value of one in like new condition??? any and all info on these rifles will be greatly appreciated
hate for all the dumb questions but like some help and know this is the place to get it :)
All Savages are essentially the same, long or short actions, just have different window dressing.
Stock differences, center or stagger feed, barrel profiles, or trigger choices.
Savages are nice in the modularity, and shade-tree mechanic side of life. But given their QC issues that are never ending, they really are a Yugo.
Despite what they charge for them new, they are still only about a $300 - 350 rifle in my eyes.
wow wasn't expecting that response, thought savages was supposed to be good rifles?? ive always been more partial to Remington 700"s but was hoping to find some answers on the rifle im lookin at.
If you want an reliable, accurate and inexpensive rifle then Savage is an option. To compair it to one brand of an automobile or another is highly subjective, based on one individual experiences and preferences. Myself, I would not compair a Savage rifle to a Yugo but perhaps I have low standards. As for price, I do not have the experience to suggest what a 10FP LE 2A is worth, but I did talk to a gentleman at my local rage once. He suggested that if one wanted a accurate rifle on a limited budget then he would suggest a Savage 10/110 FCP. He stated that his 10/110 FCP shot as good as his other purpose built rifles. Of course he may have been a poor shot but he was better than me.
I know back in the day and I mean the 80"s I had a new savage rifle and it was a total POS I mean it was a turd. but I know these days savage makes good rifles. I take long range tactical shooting classes and theres a pile of savages there that shoot great at a 1,000 yards. but its the chevy/ford battle guys with remingtons bash savages and vice versa. id just like to know some info on the 10 FP LE2A to see what they are like, problems, what they worth. just wanna make sure im not looking at trading for another POS.
I can tell you the Savage FP line of rifles are top of the line. Here is a site for some info: http://www.gunblast.com/Savage10FP-LE2.htm
Savages are good rifles, but they do have their limitations, just like remingtons. Remington rifles, and specifically their actions are great because most gunsmiths are trained on them. The aftermarket support is great. However, in recent years, their QC has gone out the window. They don't shoot as well as they used to out of the box. Their actions, do feel better out of the box.
Some of the problems I have seen with Savage rifles over the years: mostly ejecting rounds, weak extraction. However, most Savages shoot very well out of the box. Neither Savage, nor Remington would be my first choice of action to take to Baghdad. If you want to overcome these shortcomings, you should probably look at custom action.
Most shooters though would be very content with a Savage out of the box, and that Savage would out-shoot most shooters.
I think Darkker may have been alluding to the fact that no matter how many letters come after the 10/110 on a Savage they are the same gun at their core. They are not a premium gun and have challenges as well as benefits. Expect good accuracy and not much else and you will be happy.
As for value on the gun you are looking at, I would look at it as a sum of the parts myself. How much would it cost to build one from parts vs. buying this one complete.
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Originally Posted by blacdog06
Hair is exactly correct. Fundamentally they are all the same, there is no "special" line that gets extra attention or the popes blessings. Back when they were a $300 gun, you could get one that shot every bit as well as the competitors $500+ rifles; with the perk that the average joe could re-barrel, etc. However they were a $300 gun for a reason, and as you(blacdog06) noted they had some attrocious things get by the "QC" dept.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hair_Boxers
What finally has gotten around is that they CAN have some amazing barrels, which is most definitely true. But the QC issues have not changed, and that part of campfire stories get omitted. Now with the circulation of "Hey that thing can shoot!" the prices are no longer in the $300 range, but the components used most certainly still are.
So lets get to your last specific questions, as I see them from wrenching on them for the past several decades.
1 & 2) Yes, as already covered; but it isn't over. They STILL have those types of issues. Do a very little searching and you will still find that to be an ongoing issue, and now that a defense contractor owns them, don't expect anything great to come of it. In the past decade they have had an absolute rash of barrels(personal experience) that can only be most accurately described as being corrugated from button chatter. It was more prevalent in the Axis series, but wasn't exclusive to them. They most recently had a very large batch of horrendously short-chambered Creedmoors leave the factory. They also have a seemingly un-ending "half-drop" issue with the crap-u-triggers. Adjust them for light weight, and they will half-drop on closing; but at least you get some creep from the factory. Most inexperienced shooters won't notice this, as long as the pull weight is light. Also don't try and do any work on them with a file, they have a very very shallow surface hardening, and the substrate is very soft metal.
3) Fine and dandy, but we also have people who don't wash their socks during match season. Take that for what it is, and not what it isn't.
4) If you want a gaurantee, you'll have to buy one. Savage are all fundamentally the same, simply stock options and barrel profiles differ.
They churn out receivers, and barrels and start grabbing from the piles. There are no "better" rifles inherently.
This isn't to say that they are the scourge of the earth, nor will they cause the sun to never rise. But a statement of fact to get you an honest idea of what to potentially expect.
I've had dozens of Salvages over the years, and they still have some VERY appealing things to me. But at this point I have only kept a very old FP. It's the only rifle that hasn't caused me some issues.
For a practical view of it look at it like an old pickup with a Carburetor Vs. Fuel injection.
Carb - Yes, you can actually work on it yourself, and don't need expensive tools or an engineering degree. The downfall is that not only CAN you work on them, you MUST work on them routinely to keep them correct.
F.I. - No, you likely cannot work on them without training or special equipment. Alternatively, you likely won't ever HAVE to work on them in the practical lifespan of the vehicle.
Another thing to keep in mind is that every manufacturer produces turds.
My friends Kimber 300wsm Montana is an example of one that got through the cracks. It is a 4moa gun on a good day. And they aren't much help in fixing that issue.
As a general rule the more you pay the less likely the gun is a turd.
The cost of materials is going to be roughly the same. It's the man hours that usually determine final price. It takes more time to keep tolerances tight and carefully inspect every unit.
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You are getting some very good input. This particular thread is one of the best "rant free" objective appraisals I have seen in a long time....relative to Savage firearms.Quote:
new guy here looking for few answers on a possible trade i'm maybe doing. haven't had much experience with savages so need some input.