Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
I have seen many how too's for bedding a one piece scope base. Several of these techniques call for snugging down the screws on the side of the mount that is being bedded.
It would seem to my that this would be counter productive as this would cause the mount to still bend down and squishing out most of the bedding material, thus eliminating the benefits of bedding.
Wouldn't it be best to not use the screws on the side that is being bedded and only tighten down the side of the rail that isn't being bedded?
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
You could, but you need something there to keep the alignment proper, so the screws should be installed, but not snugged down. Make sure to use release agent on the threads
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
The amount of bedding actually needed is a very small amount.
My process:
Rough up the surface of the base with a low speed drum on a dremel.
Apply car wax to top of receiver, base screws, and threads in receiver.
Mix a small amount of bedding compound - apply to base, leaving at least 1/8" gap around screw holes (bedding will push towards inside as well as outside)
Install base, tighten screws in steps - snug, then up to 20 inch pounds, then 30 inch pounds. This allows the bedding compound to flow.
Let dry and remove excess.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
It depends on how warped your receiver is.
Try tightening just the front set of screws then examine the rear section of the rail to see if it is floating, then remove the front screws and repeat with the rear screws to see if the front section floats.
What you want is a stress free situation where you aren't bending or torquing the rail when you tighten down all 4 screws plus the even contact that bedding will give you.
Once you figure out if there is any gap-osis, proceed to bed it but only tighten the screws on the end that had any float just enough to give firm contact with the bedding compound. Once the bedding is cured, tighten all screws to spec.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
I'm not sure that I am clear on the concept of "scope mount bedding".
Is this a common problem?
I don't recall ever having a one piece base from a known manufacturer not fitting the receiver properly. The idea of inserting a dissimilar material like epoxy between steel and steel doesn't make sense to me.
Educate me.
uj
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
It arises from the fact that Savage and other manufacturers drill their scope mount holes before heat treating the actions. The heat treat process can warp and take the holes out of alignment. It is not always a problem, but is considerable in some.
Bedding the rail will allow bedding material fill any gap between the rail and action. It lets the screws to be fully tightened without distorting the rail.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcloco
The amount of bedding actually needed is a very small amount.
My process:
Rough up the surface of the base with a low speed drum on a dremel.
Apply car wax to top of receiver, base screws, and threads in receiver.
Mix a small amount of bedding compound - apply to base, leaving at least 1/8" gap around screw holes (bedding will push towards inside as well as outside)
Install base, tighten screws in steps - snug, then up to 20 inch pounds, then 30 inch pounds. This allows the bedding compound to flow.
Let dry and remove excess.
What ^ said! After it's dry I don't try to remove the base. It's married to the receiver and provides a little more stability throughout, however slight. And like my actions to stocks....I bed 'em all. ;) Farrell advises to do it and after my first Farrell, I did EGW, Warne, etc. 8)
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcloco
The amount of bedding actually needed is a very small amount.
My process:
Rough up the surface of the base with a low speed drum on a dremel.
Apply car wax to top of receiver, base screws, and threads in receiver.
Mix a small amount of bedding compound - apply to base, leaving at least 1/8" gap around screw holes (bedding will push towards inside as well as outside)
Install base, tighten screws in steps - snug, then up to 20 inch pounds, then 30 inch pounds. This allows the bedding compound to flow.
Let dry and remove excess.
This makes no sense as when you tighten the screws and squish out the bedding material you are causing the base to conform to the imperfections that the bedding material should be conforming to instead.
Also if the threads of the screws and screw hole threads are not cleaned of release agent after the bedding material curing , it would seem that the screws could back out more easily.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sliderspal
This makes no sense as when you tighten the screws and squish out the bedding material you are causing the base to conform to the imperfections that the bedding material should be conforming to instead.
Also if the threads of the screws and screw hole threads are not cleaned of release agent after the bedding material curing , it would seem that the screws could back out more easily.
Actually, the bedding that remains indicates the imperfections between the receiver and the base(s).
Have done this process in well over 75 rifles....from 204 to 338 RUM. Properly torqued base screws do not back out...even on the RUM shooting 300 gr SMK's in excess of 1800 yards.
To correctly torque 99% of all fasteners, a lube is needed. If threads are torqued dry, you are not torquing the item, but a portion of the pressure applied torquing the fastener is spent over coming the friction of the threads.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
Yes but you are still inducing stress on the base that the process of bedding is suppose to eliminate.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sliderspal
Yes but you are still inducing stress on the base that the process of bedding is suppose to eliminate.
Huh? The bedding is providing 100% (or very close to it) contact area with the receiver. So, IF the holes in the receiver AND in the base are lined up, they only act as the attaching components....no additional stress.
Try it....and see for yourself. We can type mutlipe entries....until you try it, a picture is worth a couple thousand words.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcloco
Quote:
Originally Posted by sliderspal
Yes but you are still inducing stress on the base that the process of bedding is suppose to eliminate.
Huh? The bedding is providing 100% (or very close to it) contact area with the receiver. So, IF the holes in the receiver AND in the base are lined up, they only act as the attaching components....no additional stress.
Try it....and see for yourself. We can type mutlipe entries....until you try it, a picture is worth a couple thousand words.
I think there are two different concepts being discussed in this topic, correct me if I'm wrong....
1. The base will be warped due to torquing down the screws on an action that has a warped surface or a slight bend, so you would add the bedding without torquing the screws to keep the base straight/true and once dried you could then torque (I think this is what sliderspal is discussing)
2. An action that has imperfections that the bedding will flow into allowing there to be more surface contact and a sturdier platform so you torque the screws and allow the bedding to flow into the imperfections. (I think this is what dcloco is talking about)
Is this correct? This what I get out of the different posts.
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrmy_1
Quote:
Originally Posted by dcloco
Quote:
Originally Posted by sliderspal
Yes but you are still inducing stress on the base that the process of bedding is suppose to eliminate.
Huh? The bedding is providing 100% (or very close to it) contact area with the receiver. So, IF the holes in the receiver AND in the base are lined up, they only act as the attaching components....no additional stress.
Try it....and see for yourself. We can type mutlipe entries....until you try it, a picture is worth a couple thousand words.
I think there are two different concepts being discussed in this topic, correct me if I'm wrong....
1. The base will be warped due to torquing down the screws on an action that has a warped surface or a slight bend, so you would add the bedding without torquing the screws to keep the base straight/true and once dried you could then torque (I think this is what sliderspal is discussing)
2. An action that has imperfections that the bedding will flow into allowing there to be more surface contact and a sturdier platform so you torque the screws and allow the bedding to flow into the imperfections. (I think this is what dcloco is talking about)
Is this correct? This what I get out of the different posts.
Yes I think you are correct.
I guess the question should be.
Which one of the two issues you list is the most likely issue to have to use bedding to correct?
Re: Proper bedding technique for one piece base.
One thing not mentioned, check the base with a straight edge of you do not have access to a surface plate. more than likely it is not the problem. Warping is one issue the other is the person hand polishing the action for blueing. My action was higher in the front than the rear so I bedded the base. Now the base is flat when torqued. Your other option is to lap the rings to correct this condition. YMMV
