nitride receivers

[philkryder]

I was hoping someone could point me to thread dealing with nitriding receivers not barrels.

I seem to remember reading in one of the barrel threads that the receivers would distort from nitriding.

the specific question is
"does nitriding undo the effects of timing and truing?"

[airaddict]

+1

my next build i want to be on a long action but i plan to go all out on a target/varmit rifle in either 260ai or 223ai (kind of leaning towards 223ai cuz i want a small caliber but may comprimise on a 22-250ai so i can easily switch barrels to 260ai).

i would like it to be T&T and then send off barrel, receiver, nut and lug to get nitrided.

brian

[snipecatcher]

Look at the "Aftermarket Barrels" section of the forum. Check out the "Nitride the barrel" thread. There is some info on receivers.
In short, there have been some problems with receivers warping because they were not properly heat treated. Your Savage receiver should be OK to nitride, as long as it is properly taken apart, i.e. barrel and bolt removed etc. When I send my barrel in, I'm going to have the receiver and bolt body done also. Hope that helps.
Regards,
-Dan

[philkryder]

Look at the "Aftermarket Barrels" .....
In short, there have been some problems with receivers warping because they were not properly heat treated....



yeah - I think I saw that.

I'm looking for the "long" answer that says something like either
"forget about it, T&T tolerances are so perfect that even a slight amount of distortion will render them pointless"
or
"there is no way to really tell WHAT will happen, the only way to be sure is to redo the heat treatment then T&T and then nitride."
or
"I've had several receivers Timed and Trued BEFORE nitriding and the nitriding only made them smother. they still had over 90% contact on the bolt lugs...

[philkryder]

Perusing the thread on barrel nitriding again,
I found the following note from Mr. Hammer that states the actions will "move" after the nitriding presumably due to lack of stress relief. Does that mean there is no safe way to do the time and true and then nitride?
Is there some other method that could give similar wear and corrosion resistance without the distortion of nitriding?
???
I'm stunned by the silence...



Not everyone is doing the same thing at the same temperature.
However, one would have to cook a Savage action @ 1500 degrees for some hours to take the hardness out of the action. No one to my knowledge comes close to this heat nor time in bath.
I can see where a business man would decline to accept responsibility for hardening (Nitriding) an action when he knows that certain protocol was followed by different manufacturers for hardening their actions. Savage, Remington and whomever is building an action sends their actions out for stress testing to assure us as the purchaser the action is safe. Once a heat treater dips he assumes the responsibility.

Some of us have punched actions before and after Nitriding with little effect or change after Nitriding. One of my actions (Savage was done at 1200 degrees for an hour before they quenched it at 750 in oil. It was 69R on the outside and 39R under the Nitride. It was 42 R prior to treatment. Fred has done a whole lot more than I with Savages so he would be better on the hardness thing. I know from punching 6 Actions for hardness the front of the action or receiver end of the action ran between 40-43R and the rear bridge ran 39-41R.

I know that Savage does not stress relieve with heat or fluid because my actions moved when I had it done to them. I had to relieve bedding and open up the screw holes a few thou because the action did not fit in the stock when I got it back without forcing it in by hand. SO I am going to guess that Savage uses electricity to harden their actions.
Neal

[rinodods]

I think the silence you are stunned by is due to lack of data. This really hasn't been that popular and many may have not even heard of the process much less had the T&T plus nitride done. I'd like to see answers myself but somebody might just have to take the leap and let us know. Any volunteers?

[airaddict]

if r worried about it warping, just cerakote the action. i had it done to a mossberg 500 that would rust at the mention of moisture. it turned out super nice and corrosion resistant, more so than durakote. supposedly the companysays the only thing that will remove it once cured is abrasive blasting. that way you can T&T ur action and not worry about the measurements being thrown off.

i will nitride the action and barrel of my next build. im game to try it once.

brian b

[philkryder]

I'm concerned that things like the Cerakote would change dimensions all by themselves.

As I understand it,
the nitriding adds virtually no thickness.

did you coat the inner surfaces of the receiver and the bolt lugs with the CeraKote?

[airaddict]

they do say cerakote does add slight thickness. it didnt affect the mating surfaces of my mossberg (including the C-lect choke threads on the muzzle) but its not as a tight fit as a threaded rifle receiver either.

ive read on here that the nitride is a super hard and slick surface that has no "thickness" like cerakote since the base metal itself is changed due to the heat process.

i dont think i would coat the threads of a receiver or the lug mating surfaces but i dont see why not the inner surfaces of the bolt raceway. the company that makes cerakote says its supposedly very long wearing and shows tests of the resistance to wear.

brian

[ellobo]

Nitrideing is nothing more than a surface hardening technique that is not needed on a receiver. A lapping of the receways will smooth things out on the bolt. The heat treating of a receiver is a through process that hardens the entire thickness of the receiver and is more than adequate for long use under normal conditions. Nitriding is just an unessesary expense as far as I am concerned.

El Lobo