7.62 X 51 in a Savage?

[aztrooper]

I have a new Savage 10FCP 308 caliber. I have not shot it yet but bought a 20rnd box of 7.62X51 German ammo at a gun show to shoot. The label has a circle with a cross in it and is labeled LOS MEN94H0010. When I called Savage about another issue, I asked if it was OK to shoot the 7.62X51 ammo and he said NO. When I said it was the same physical size, he said "we do not make a rifle for 7.62X51. What's up with that? Anyone shot this ammo or other surplus ammo in the 308?

Bob

[bootsmcguire]

technically the 308 and 7.62x51 are different, and Savage chambers for 308 Win.
My understanding is the 7.62x51 is safe in a 308, but don't quote me on that. I know 5.56 is not safe in a 223 due to higher preasures and I think 308 & 7.62x51 is the other way around. Do a search in the forum this was discussed not to long ago.

[aztrooper]

technically the 308 and 7.62x51 are different, and Savage chambers for 308 Win.
My understanding is the 7.62x51 is safe in a 308, but don't quote me on that. I know 5.56 is not safe in a 223 due to higher preasures and I think 308 & 7.62x51 is the other way around. Do a search in the forum this was discussed not to long ago.

I did a search to see if it was safe. I know that one was done on the differences and the consenses was that the 7.62 X 51 had higher pressures. Don't want to take a chance on blowing up my new rifle or me either.

Bob

[hotbrass]

Whoever that was at Savage is either not properly educated or they are practicing the fine art of CYA. I have no doubt that Savage does not make a rifle in "7.62x51."

The 7.62x51 is perfectly safe to shoot in a .308.

Unlike the .223 vs 5.56x45, the 7.62x51 vs .308 does not have the same pressure issues.

Ref: http://www.saami.org/specifications_and_information/publications/download/SAAMI_ITEM_211-Unsafe_Arms_and_Ammunition_Combinations.pdf

[pbcaster45]

I've shot plenty of 7.62x51 in my 10FLP. The circle with the cross in it means it's NATO spec and loaded to a slightly lower pressure than most factory .308 Winchester ammo (safe to use in gas guns like the M14/M1A). LOS MEN94H0010 is the lot number and it should have a three star primer crimp with green primer sealant.

[Tim300wsm]

my main question is why would you buy an expensive accurate rifle and shoot junk inaccurate surplus ammo? kinda counter productive if you look you can find good deals a shop in my area has federal gold medal match for 12.99 a box they do mail order the phone number is (585)248-3660 Biekirchs

[hotbrass]

Why do you think 7.62x51 NATO spec ammo is junk? Do you feel the same way about 5.56x45 NATO ammo?

Just curious.

[pbcaster45]

hotbrass raises a good point, some surplus is very good. The M852 I've fired is as good as my handloads. And the M118 I tested was not bad either.

http://savageshooters.com/SavageForum/index.php/topic,32117.0.html

[aztrooper]

I've shot plenty of 7.62x51 in my 10FLP. The circle with the cross in it means it's NATO spec and loaded to a slightly lower pressure than most factory .308 Winchester ammo (safe to use in gas guns like the M14/M1A). LOS MEN94H0010 is the lot number and it should have a three star primer crimp with green primer sealant.




Thanks. That's the stuff. As far as buying "inexpensive junk" ammo Tim300wsm, I asked the Savage guy about breaking in the barrel and he said they really didn't recommend any particular method or it not needing a break in so with that in mind, I would rather shoot the first 20 rounds with $9/20 rounds than $20/20 rounds.

[aztrooper]

technically the 308 and 7.62x51 are different, and Savage chambers for 308 Win.
My understanding is the 7.62x51 is safe in a 308, but don't quote me on that. I know 5.56 is not safe in a 223 due to higher preasures and I think 308 & 7.62x51 is the other way around. Do a search in the forum this was discussed not to long ago.


When I had a Savage 10FP in 223, I called Savage about the same issue, using 5.56 in it. They advised me that it was OK to shoot it as they had made the barrel to accept it similar to Ruger's newer mini 14's. Surprised me when they told me no on the 7.62.

[tammons]

That was CYA from savage.

223/5.56 is different.

5.56 nato runs at a higher pressure the 223 and may not be safe in a 223 chamber depending.
Supposedly the savage chambers are wylde chambers and will work for both.

From what I know the 7.62x51 nato runs at a lower pressure than 308 so it should be okay.
55k for the nato and 60k for the 308.
I think the case dimensions are the same but not 100%, but I have never known anybody that had problems
shooting 7.62 nato in a 308 rifle.

[aztrooper]

Thanks for everyone's input. I think I will go ahead and shoot the 20 rounds I have and then buy good 308 from here out.

[Eric in NC]

There will never be a problem shooting 7.62x51 ammo in a 308 (unless it is bad ammo like some of the Indian surplus on the market a while back).

It is exactly the opposite of the 5.56/223 situation - milsurp 7.62x51 is safe to shoot in commercial rifles, commercial 308 may not be safe to shoot in military rifles (CETMEs, Indian Enfields, etc.).

[tammons]

Maybe the person at savage was thinking of the 7.62x54 ??

[csam]

"...my main question is why would you buy an expensive accurate rifle and shoot junk inaccurate surplus ammo?"

The German 7.62 is no junk, not by a long stretch, there is definitely some junk surplus military ammo on the market. The German, Austrian, British, S. African and Australian all excellent quality and can and will shoot quite accurately. Not what I would use for benchrest, but perfectly good in the accuracy and reliability dept. Stay away from Indian and Pakistani surplus or pretty much any flavor. Not much good to say about it.

[pizzabox]

hotbrass raises a good point, some surplus is very good. The M852 I've fired is as good as my handloads. And the M118 I tested was not bad either.

http://savageshooters.com/SavageForum/index.php/topic,32117.0.html




There was a guy at our 200 yard range breaking in a .308 Savage Tactical something. He was already on paper at 200 but had yet to achieve good grouping. I handed him 4 rounds of 173 gr. M-118. I spotted for him and said, don't worry about where you are on the target, just shoot for group. Aside from one rd. a little off.(windy) the other 3 rounds were a single ragged little hole.

[pizzabox]

There will never be a problem shooting 7.62x51 ammo in a 308 (unless it is bad ammo like some of the Indian surplus on the market a while back).

It is exactly the opposite of the 5.56/223 situation - milsurp 7.62x51 is safe to shoot in commercial rifles, commercial 308 may not be safe to shoot in military rifles (CETMEs, Indian Enfields, etc.).


It is safe, depending. I shoot quite a bit of .308 in my M1A NM frequently. Depends on the head space. My M1A measure 1.631 which is fine for .308. Because mine is a gas gun I try not to shoot the heavies as it's hard on the op-rod.

[hotbrass]

Headspace spec is the same for 5.62x51 and .308. But it varies from gun to gun.