110L 264 Win Mag

[MTHighlander]

New here, have lurked some. First post.

I just picked up a 110L in 264 Win Mag. Left hand action, Bushnell elite 4200, and a custom stock. What did I get myself into? :)

I understand these basically don't exist.

Am I correct this is a 1:9 twist? I'm trying to figure out a bullet to load some rounds. A local gunshop has some Remington Core-Lokt 140gr ammo on the shelf for it, but it's $80/box. I can pickup some brass, dies, and bullets from Midway for the price of 40 rounds.

I've been looking at the JBM stability calculator (https://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmstab-5.1.cgi), and it looks like 140gr Nosler BT and Hornady Interlock 140gr should stabilize. I'd like to use the Speer Impact 140gr, but I can't find any good info on the length of the bullet.

I guess this is more of a rant, but if anyone has any info to help me out, thanks in advance.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/991768804


(https://www.gunbroker.com/item/991768804)

[Robinhood]

Beautiful wood on that stock. I have heard that the 140 partitions are bad medicine for game with that cartridge.

[Whynot]

1-9 should stabilize the 140 bullets (unless you get into solids or some new crazy bullet).... but any traditional lead/copper hunting bullet should be good. I shoot much higher BC match bullets in a 260 with a 1-9 twist.

[MTHighlander]

I guess I'll buy some Speers (https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1021050618?pid=301539) and give them a try. Thanks

[MTHighlander]

Beautiful wood on that stock. I have heard that the 140 partitions are bad medicine for game with that cartridge.

I'm having trouble finding anything but Ballistic Tips from Nosler. I'd prefer the accubonds but they are unobtainable as of now.

[MTHighlander]

Doing a little digging on Speers website I found some load data for the 264 Win mag using the Impacts (https://www.speer.com/on/demandware.static/-/Library-Sites-VistaSpeerSharedLibrary/default/dw56045eab/productPdfFiles/TB264H1%20Reloading%20Data.pdf). Feeling better about it now.

[BobT]

That's a beauty! Hopefully it's a great shooter, the 140 grain bullets should be fine!

[Dave Hoback]

High BC 140’s+ won’t have the best stability with 1:9; bullets like the VLD’s, Sierra MK’s & Hornady ELD lines. But any shorter 140gr like most hunting bullets, Spitzers & such, will be fine. And high BC Target bullets under 140 are short enough to stabilize. Those spears look to be right at the upper most threshold for stabilization with your rifle’s 1:9 twist.

[MTHighlander]

Berger has a better calc http://https://bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/ (https://bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/)

It's close. I got 50 to try. It's going to be temp dependent. I'll report what I find.

[Dave Hoback]

Yes, that’s a decent calculator. You’ll find most of the 140’s will be in the marginal safe are. This will limit long range accuracy. But within a specific distance, they will be fine.

[MTHighlander]

As luck would have it, my local gunshop has the Speer Impact .264 140gr in stock.

Bullet length = 1.222
Tip Length = 0.1615

Overall length 1.3835

Ideally I don't like shooting over 400 yards regardless of caliber / twist / stability. I'll get some of these loaded up and head to the range when I can.

[Whynot]

Berger has a better calc http://https://bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/ (https://bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/)

It's close. I got 50 to try. It's going to be temp dependent. I'll report what I find.

I just assumed with your user name that you were at high elevation in MT? If that is the case then it should not even be questionable. When you go to the calculator adjust the elevation and see how much of a difference it makes.... increasing speed makes small changes and would guess that you will be around the 3000fps area-- so not seeing any issues-. It should be gyroscopically stable-- and at 400 yards and in you shouldn't need to worry about dynamic stability.

But a stable bullet can still shoot lousy...

[MTHighlander]

I just assumed with your user name that you were at high elevation in MT? If that is the case then it should not even be questionable. When you go to the calculator adjust the elevation and see how much of a difference it makes.... increasing speed makes small changes and would guess that you will be around the 3000fps area-- so not seeing any issues-. It should be gyroscopically stable-- and at 400 yards and in you shouldn't need to worry about dynamic stability.

But a stable bullet can still shoot lousy...

Yes sir, up high here in the Rockies. I'm using 2800FPS, 4000FT, and just to be insane -40 for the temp. No one in their right mind would be out there in those temps, but it's possible. 49F and we're at 1.5.

Once the season rolls around here, it could be 70F, or it could be -10F. And that could be consecutive days, the weather is crazy here sometimes.

You're right though, even a stable bullet can shoot lousy. We'll see what happens. I got a bunch on IMR4350, too fast for this? I think I'm going to need to find some Magnum, H1000, Retumbo, 8133, or Reloader 26/33. https://shootersreference.com/reloadingdata/264-winchester-magnum/

[Dave Hoback]

The 4350 will work.., any of them. (IMR, Hodgdon, Accurate) But not ideal. Just approach the upper charge limits carefully; nothing new.

Here is a great video on Twist rate & SG. Pay attention to the values he speaks of using & still seeing superb accuracy. Both over & under the magical 1.5 SG. There is just so much Theory attached to beliefs concerning twist rates & being too low or too high. One course of thought is basically if the bullets aren’t key-holing the target, it ain’t too slow! And if the bullets aren’t coming apart and vaporizing from RPM, it ain’t too fast! I pretty much agree.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5vKRtP_kBI

[PhilC]

Favorite load in my 7RM was 150 NBTs over IMR4350 and worked just fine, see no reason it won't do the same in 264WM.

Nosler's data from the .pdf available on their website - https://www.nosler.com/264-winchester-magnum

Btw, this data with a 24", 9 twist barrel too.

IMR 4320 50.0 * MAX. 2848
48.0 2763
46.0 2678
IMR 4064 51.0 MAX. 2860
49.0 2790
47.0 * 2720
Hunter 54.0 MAX. 2913
52.0 2835
50.0 * 2756
RL22 (most accurate powder tested)
59.0 MAX. 2929
57.0 2821
55.0 * 2712
H4350 52.0 MAX. 2930
50.0 * 2852
48.0 2775
W760 54.5 * MAX. 2940
52.5 2865
50.5 2791
IMR 4831 59.0 MAX. 2970
57.0 2870
55.0 * 2770
IMR 4350 57.0 * MAX. 2980
55.0 2920
53.0 2860
RL19 57.5 MAX. 3024
55.5 * 2948
53.5 2872
LRT 75.0 * MAX. 3085
73.0 2998
71.0 2910

[MTHighlander]

Phil and Dave, thanks for the info.

[charlie b]

Stability is one of those things you can get mixed up with.

First, if it is stable at the muzzle it will be stable at range. The spin rate decreases VERY slowly so unless you are shooting a mile or more what happens at the muzzle is key.

Second, the formulas are simplified. They are based on a football shaped projectile at above mach 2 (~2800fps). When you get close to mach 1 the formulas kinda fall apart. The movement of shock waves on the bullet in the transonic range dominate the stability. That's why it is important for most bullets to stay either above or below the speed of sound. Some shapes are better than others at the transonic range with blunt/round noses being a little better for some reason. Maybe because the shock wave doesn't move very far?

Last, the 'stability factor' is kinda vague. Is 1.5 good or does it need to be 1.7 or 2.0? Kinda depends on the bullet and velocity. Some shapes tolerate a lower value while others go wonky at a higher value. IMHO it depends on the construction of the bullet and where the CG is relative to the aerodynamic 'center'.

Basically try it and see. If your bullets show no oblong holes or shotgun patterns at 100yd you should be good. FWIW, the stability equations said the 77gn SMK was marginal in my .223. Those bullets were wonderful out to 600yd.

[Dave Hoback]

I agree Charlie. In the video I posted, the host outlines this pretty well. As good an argument as any other. More convincing to my discernment anyway.

[prdatr]

Shooters Pro has the AB's for sale every now and then.
https://www.shootersproshop.com/6-5mm-140gr-accubond-50ct-blem.html