Bullet seating depth

[Mr.Snerdly]

On my reloads I started off .030" off the lands, went to .025" then to .015" I haven't shot the .015" yet and need advice. They say the depth of seating in the brass should be approximately the diameter of the bullet. I thought I had them deep enough but upon actual measurement I found out they weren't. Even the .030" off the lands wasn't deep enough. Is it absolutely necessary to have them seated to the depth of the caliber diameter? This is a 223 with a 52 grain bullet. Maybe a heavier bullet would have more depth with the same distance from the lands. I am completely new at all this and need lots of advice. This is the 223 with the 1:9 twist so I think a heavier bullet would work.

[6mmBR_Shooter]

With a short 52 grain bullet in a factory chamber I'm thinking you're going to have a hard time getting seating depth close to the lands. If chasing lands in that rifle, you may need to up the bullet to upwards of a 68/69. That may still not be long enough for you. Your best bet may just be to find a jump tolerant bullet in the lighter weights.

[CFJunkie]

6mm BR Shooter is right.
Light bullets just aren't long enough to seat out far enough to get close to the lands in most .223 rifles.

I have two .223 bolt actions and even when new, a 52 grain bullet was just about out of the neck of the brass before it got close to the lands.
The bullet body that touches the rifling on a Sierra 52 gr SMK #1410 is under 0.39 inches when you take the boat tail out of the measurement. The entire bullet is only 0.710.
Even a flat base 53 gr SMK #1400 has only about 0.020 more bullet body touching the lands with a bullet length of 0.714.
A 69 SMK #1380 has about 0.440 touching the lands when you subtract the boat tail with a bullet overall length of 0.913. An extra 0.2 inches makes a lot of difference.
A 77 SMK #9377 has about 0.560 when you subtract the boat tail with an overall length of 0.987 and the extra 0.0.275 inches let you seat it out far enough to get close to the chamber depth.
My 69 and 77 grain bullets have no problem but the light bullets just aren't long enough.

But when I seat the 52 grain and 53 grain bullets at 2.250 to 2.260 O.A.L., they shoot very accurately in both rifles.
I wouldn't get too worried about seating them back far enough so there is enough bullet body in the neck to maintain consistent neck tension with the light bullets.
They shoot just fine that way.
Sometimes all the 'expert' advice just can't be followed because reality gets in the way.

[Bill2905]

6mmBR_Shooter and CFJunkie are spot on.

Rules of thumb are there as a good starting point. Knowing the effects of increasing or reducing your seating depth is key. If you understand this and follow prudent load development practices, you will be fine.

I encountered the opposite problem when I started loading the 223. My factory rifle has a shorter throat and I couldn't seat some lighter bullets at the recommended COAL without jamming them into the lands. I fretted about this for a while until I figured out that seating depth is not absolute.

[Mr.Snerdly]

Thanks for the help. I can't recall exact figure without going through all the steps again but I think I have about .170" in the brass when they are seated to .030 from the lands. I know that will work but I did reseat the ones that were .015 from the lands. Some say seating depth isn't that important, some say it is. It seems there are as many opinions as when we discuss Ford, Chevy and MoPar or John Deere and CaseIH.

I might try a heavier bullet. Bad part is you have to buy 100 of them to find out if they work better. It would be nice to have several friends with the same caliber and maybe we could trade bullets, say 25 or 30 and see what works best for each gun. This hobby is not the most expensive in the world but it is getting to be a little more than I figured. It seems there is always another trinket or something you just have to have. It is fun though, I have to admit.

[Iowa Fox]

Precision Reloading used to sell sample packs of 10-15 of different bullets including some of the more premiums. Not sure if they still do. They are nice folks and regularly support the matches with things on the prize table so I try to buy from them when I can. I've seen some factory chambers with throats so long that the bullet is out of the case by a 1/4" before the ogive gets close to the rifling. Its just the way it is. On those the Lee factory crimp die sometimes helps the bullet get a good start.

https://www.precisionreloading.com/

[hardnosestreetcop]

On my reloads I started off .030" off the lands, went to .025" then to .015" I haven't shot the .015" yet and need advice. They say the depth of seating in the brass should be approximately the diameter of the bullet. I thought I had them deep enough but upon actual measurement I found out they weren't. Even the .030" off the lands wasn't deep enough. Is it absolutely necessary to have them seated to the depth of the caliber diameter? This is a 223 with a 52 grain bullet. Maybe a heavier bullet would have more depth with the same distance from the lands. I am completely new at all this and need lots of advice. This is the 223 with the 1:9 twist so I think a heavier bullet would work.

As another option you could just by some Black Hills 223 52 Gr BTHP, test say 5 or ten shoots see it your rifle likes that load. Using your calibers measure 10-15 rounds out of the box, and use their OAL as a benchmark. Good luck and tight groups.

[6mmBR_Shooter]

In 223, many of the lighter bullets are jump tolerant. They must be, since factory rifles aren't throated short enough to have them close to the lands.

I shoot 80 grainers in my 7 twist service rifle for the 600 yard line. The lightest bullet I shoot through that rifle are the Hornady 68s loaded to magazine length for cheap practice. They shoot very very well, even though there is a pretty substantial jump to get there.

I'm sitting on a substantial amount of the Hornady 68s. I'll send you some to try for free if you'd like. Just shoot me your address.

[Nor Cal Mikie]

"Sometimes all the 'expert' advice just can't be followed because reality gets in the way"

Best bet? See what YOUR rifle likes and go from there. What works for me probably won't work for you.
And with most factory chambers, no way will you be able to get close to the lands.
I get all my chambers (custom) cut with ZERO freebore. I bench shoot and load with all my bullets seated .010 INTO the lands. I start off with the lightest bullets I can get my hands on and as the throat wears, I go to heavier bullets so I can still be jammed into the lands. And I single load so mag length isn't an issue for me.
If I load a round with XXX grains of powder and seat the bullet to a "jump", it will start showing pressure signs at a certain point. That same load with the bullet seated INTO the lands will not show pressure signs and I can up the powder charge a bit more with no issues. (we learn as we go) ;)
Let your target tell you what the best seating depth is for YOUR rifle.

[Texas10]

What barrel/chamber are you shooting and how many rounds down the tube? I've got a Criterion 223 in a match chamber and shoot the 52 Sierra p/n 1400 in both that barrel and a stock Savage 9 twist with no neck retention issues. If you've got a deeper throat, or worn barrel try the 55 gr V-Max. You'll notice that it sits way deeper in the case than the 53 V-max or Sierra 52 g due to its tangent ogive design when loaded to touch dimensions.

[js223]

I agree with the other guys, that 52 not reaching the lands in the factory chamber while having enough neck engagement is not a big surprise. As I recall the 52 SMK worked fine in a factory 223 chamber (1/9 twist) while loaded to magazine length (well back from the lands in other words).

[Stumpkiller]

They say the depth of seating in the brass should be approximately the diameter of the bullet.

I think you misheard them. The case neck supporting the bullet should be at least as long as the bullet diameter(*); but the base of the bullet can go deeper into the case as needed. I have some accurate loads with the base even with the wider end of the shoulder and compressing the powder. Look at the cannelures of some of the higher SD bullets so equipped. That's where the case mouth is. They are much deeper than bullet diameter.

6795

*Note also that some cases - like the .300 Win Mag - is accurate even though the case neck is quite a bit shorter than the bullet is wide. Opinions change and other factors like bore to chamber alignment are more critical.

[Mr.Snerdly]

In 223, many of the lighter bullets are jump tolerant. They must be, since factory rifles aren't throated short enough to have them close to the lands.

I shoot 80 grainers in my 7 twist service rifle for the 600 yard line. The lightest bullet I shoot through that rifle are the Hornady 68s loaded to magazine length for cheap practice. They shoot very very well, even though there is a pretty substantial jump to get there.

I'm sitting on a substantial amount of the Hornady 68s. I'll send you some to try for free if you'd like. Just shoot me your address.

That is very generous of you but I wouldn't feel right if you just gave them to me. I have some other bullets you might like to try. Maybe we could work out a trade of some type, if you would be interested in that. I haven't figured how to send a PM yet and I don't know if I would want to put my name and address out for everyone to see. Can you send a PM on this board?

[6mmBR_Shooter]

That is very generous of you but I wouldn't feel right if you just gave them to me. I have some other bullets you might like to try. Maybe we could work out a trade of some type, if you would be interested in that. I haven't figured how to send a PM yet and I don't know if I would want to put my name and address out for everyone to see. Can you send a PM on this board?

Looks like you don't have the option to email or message on your profile. This link gives information on how to set up both email and private messages...
https://www.savageshooters.com/faq.php?faq=vb3_user_profile#faq_vb3_private_messa ges

[charlie b]

I think he needs some more posts to qualify?

[243winxb]

https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?media/223-5-56-minimum-bullet-shank-in-contact-with-neck.1429/fullMy minimum to keep bullets from getting crooked on chambering, if they contact the feed ramp.