Savage 12 VLP........Tumbling bullets

[guhunter]

Bought a Savage 12 vlp 1-7" twist 223 a few months ago and broke the barrel in without optics. Mounted a Vortex Viper and went to sight in. The target revealed that the bullets are tumbling almost immediately as they leave the bore. With both 55 (not a proper bullet weight for twist, I understand) and 69 grain. I had planned to shoot primarily 75 and 80 grain loads through this rifle and am really doubting I'll see any better results when I am getting keyholing at 15 feet. Anyone had this issue?

[dcloco]

Any copper in the barrel?

With the rifle unloaded, shine a flashlight across the muzzle. If there is any brown/rust/copper color...then you have a coppered up barrel.

Either of those bullets will stabilize in that barrel.

Be careful though, shooting light/middle weight bullets in a 1:7 twist will allow you to find out how to blow bullets up. Some blow up just outside the end of the barrel, some make it 15 feet. Will just be a cloud of gray and no holes in the target.

[guhunter]

No copper in the barrel. For the first 11 rounds (the ones just fired were 12, 13, and 14) i fired one, cleaned one. For each of these cleanings, barrel was cleaned till absolutely spotless.

[racinready300ex]

What did you use to clean? You can clean untile you think it's spotless with hoppes 9, then runs some sweets through it and the patch will come out bright blue with copper.

I like the kriol, JB combo method. I've found alot of bench shooter use this, so it must be good. lol.

My only thought would be you have a bad barrel, it should be stabilizing those bullets. You could try factory bullets to ensure you're not loading them wrong. Your not hitting the ground before the target? I did that the other day at 600 yards and though my bullet was tumbling. Then increased elevation and no more keyhole.

Don't know what to tell you.

[kleeber]

Have you tried measuring the twist rate yourself?

Actually, I wonder if it is possible for the rifling step to get skipped entirely at the factory.

[guhunter]

I've been cleaning the copper with Barnes CR10 and am sure all the copper is being removed. Also, When I moved the target to 15 feet, I eyeballed the barrel to be sure I was not contacting anything before the bullet got to target so I know that's not the issue either. The barrel is rifled, but I did consider that it might have a much slower twist rate than is stamped on the barrel, but have not checked that. Would it still tumble even the 55s?

[racinready300ex]

I can't think of anything other than the barrel is bad. I've gotten bad barrels from savage, they will replace them. Give them a call see what they say.

[Eric in NC]

New gun or "new to you"?

If it is used, I would suspect a carbon ring.

[tammons]

I used to have a 1:7 twist 223 and I shot from 52 gr amaxes up to 90 gr bergers all max loads , and never blew up a bullet and never tumbled anything.

Maybe the jacket is getting damaged. Just a guess.
What does the crown look like ??

How does it group or does it shoot all over the place.

Do you actually see a sideways bullet hole ??

Seems odd that a 50 gr bullet would tumble in a 1:7 twist.

[Nefarioud]

15 feet isn't very far, I'm wondering if it's nutation you're seeing instead of tumbling. But even then something that would cause nutation that severe makes the barrel suspect.Try moving the target out to 25 yards and see if you still get the same result.

Perhaps you could post a picture of a target?

[countryboy]

why at 15 yards, back off to 25-50 and try, bullett not stabilized at 15 yds.

[5spd]

Did you inspect your crown and end of bbl with an eye loop.
I had that start to happen after about 20k rounds in a FP10 with a 1/9 twist and 50 gr vmax bullets.
It was my crown that had a burr on it right at the end of the bbl that I did not see till I got real close. I ran a cotton tip around the last inch of the bbl and saw how it was catching. Had it re-crowned and it was shooting perfect again.
Now yours may have a different issue, but thats what was my tumbling problem.

[guhunter]

The gun is brand new....less than 15 rounds down the tube. I am getting sideways bullet holes at all ranges. I did contact Savage and the guy on the phone seemed very interested to take a look at the gun. I guess we'll just have to see what they say.