5.56 Green Tip Deal

[Negan]

Hello,
I felt like this was a good deal so I wanted to share. Went to Brownells again and found a clearance deal on 5.56 green tip rounds. 600 Rounds for 219.99. There is a 19.95 hazmat charge unfortunately but if you use H7L at checkout, it will take off $20 and give you free shipping. So this deal was 219.94 out the door for a little less than .37 cents per round.

Here is the link: https://www.brownells.com/ammunition/rifle-ammo/5-56x45mm-nato-62gr-green-tip-fmj-600-case-sku100013917-96133-126654.aspx (https://www.brownells.com/ammunition/rifle-ammo/5-56x45mm-nato-62gr-green-tip-fmj-600-case-sku100013917-96133-126654.aspx)

[Robinhood]

Thanks Negan!

[bigedp51]

CHAMBER PRESSURE WARNING, M855 should not be used in short throated .223 rifles. (freebore length .0250 see line "N" in chamber dimensions below)

Lake City/military M193 ammo is loaded to 55,000 psi

Lake City/military M855 ammo is loaded to 58,700 psi

In 1979 is when the SAAMI placed the interchangeability warning for .223 and the newer 5.56 M855.

MIL-C-63989C (AR)
AMENDMENT 4
30 January 2001
SUPERSEDING
AMENDMENT 3
15 October 1999

MILITARY SPECIFICATION
CARTRIDGE 5.56mm, BALL, M855

“3.7 Chamber pressure. The average chamber pressure of the sample
cartridges, conditioned at 70 degrees plus or minus 2 degrees F, shall not
exceed 58,700 psi. Neither the chamber pressure of an individual sample
test cartridge nor the average chamber pressure plus three standard
deviations of chamber pressure shall not exceed 64,700 psi."

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=8&ved=0ahUKEwjy6dH37tXWAhUo7YMKHcyKCakQFghcMAc&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.orbitalatk.com%2Fdefense-systems%2Fsmall-caliber-systems%2F5-56mm%2Fdocs%2FPS001830%2520(M193).pdf&usg=AOvVaw30H1mY0JaV5-IWVV3bCTKn

CALIBER: 5.56x45mm
CARTRIDGE: M193 Ball

Manufactured to U.S. Military Specifications:
MIL-DTL-9963
MIL-STD-636
MIL-STD-1916
Drawing: 10523632

CHAMBER PRESSURE:
Average Maximum: 380 Mpa @ 21 C
(55,000 psi @ 70 F)

https://i.imgur.com/wjAOlWq.jpg

[Texas10]

Cheap plinking ammo! I can't use it at the ranges I go to, otherwise I'd get some.

My question is, how do you come up with the discount codes? I was on their site just a couple days ago (another of your posts) but couldn't find any reference to a coupon code. Used their chat option and got a very UN-helpful person who could only say "click on the home button, they're right there". Apparently they're trained to not give out discount codes. Went back to your post and got it, but I'd really like to learn how to find these.

What's the secret?

[bigedp51]

It would be a very bad idea to fire M855 in a short throated .223 rifle, in most cases this would be rifles with 1 in 14 or 1 in 12 twist rates.

Firing a M885 5.56 cartridge in a short throated ,223 would cause a pressure spike of 75,000 PSI. Normal rated .223 chamber pressure is 52,000 cup or 55,000 psi.

https://i.imgur.com/tviAISD.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Lz8uNjS.jpg

223 Rem vs 5.56: An Exhaustive Review
http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/223-rem-5-56-exhaustive-review/

NOTE, the throat in my Savage .223 with a 1 in 9 twist was "longer" than the throat in two AR15 rifles I have. Know thy rifle.

[J.Baker]

Here we go again...

[bigedp51]

Here we go again...

You could always tell the forum all my posts are "Fake News" and a Communist inspired plot to fool Savage rifle owners.

"OR" you could accept the fact that the chamber pressure readings I posted came from U.S. Military documents using SAAMI tranducer standards.

I for one do not understand your sour grapes attitude, "WHY" would anyone post a link for M885 ammunition when the SAAMI tells you to not shoot it in .223 rifles.

This M885 ammunition was designed for M16 type rifle with a longer throat, and even the Military M4 carbines are being pounded by these higher pressure rounds and abuse.

[Robinhood]

Information that could possibly be a sticky in the plinking forums. Kind of windy for every M855 post.

[Zero333]

It's a good reminder. So it's ok if it comes up once in a while, even if it sounds like a broke record.

In Canada M855 ammo costs 70 to 85 Canadian pennies per round (that's 56 to 68 American cents). Consider yourselves lucky.

[eddiesindian]

Used to purchase pulled SS109,s by the thousands dirt cheap years ago for plinking on my AR,s........ IMO, there great for plinking if you can roll your own. if you don't reload then Id say this is a good buy. (me personally?) wouldn't use them on a bolt gun

[J.Baker]

You could always tell the forum all my posts are "Fake News" and a Communist inspired plot to fool Savage rifle owners.

"OR" you could accept the fact that the chamber pressure readings I posted came from U.S. Military documents using SAAMI tranducer standards.

I for one do not understand your sour grapes attitude, "WHY" would anyone post a link for M885 ammunition when the SAAMI tells you to not shoot it in .223 rifles.

This M885 ammunition was designed for M16 type rifle with a longer throat, and even the Military M4 carbines are being pounded by these higher pressure rounds and abuse.

Feeling a little testy Ed? Did I say anything specifically towards you? I didn't think so.

[sharpshooter]

Could someone please shoot some of this ammo in their Savage rifle and blow it up so we can post pictures and confirm this myth?

[bigedp51]

The SAAMI issued the interchangeability warning in 1979 when the M885 round was introduced by the military.

This is because of pressure increase in short throated .223 rifles and these rifles are still being made.

Now how many new inexperienced shooters and reloaders read these postings.

The throat in my Savage .223 is longer than the throats in my AR15 rifles, "BUT" this doesn't apply to all firearms manufactures or older Savage rifles.

I didn't write this post for the people who know how long their throats are, i wrote it for the people who don't know.

Now how many of you own Savage .223 rifles made before 1979 with 1 in 12 or 1 in 14 twist or other brands of .223 rifles.

[sharpshooter]

Now how many of you own Savage .223 rifles made before 1979 with 1 in 12 or 1 in 14 twist.

The correct answer is NOBODY.

Savage didn't chamber the 223 until 1981, and then it only on model 340, 1-14 twist. The .223 wasn't offered in the 110 until 1986. Savage made a switch to a 1-12 twist on the 110's in 1992, and the model 24's remained 1-14" twist.The model 340 had been dropped. In 1993 the model 110FP was introduced with a 1-9 twist, all other 110/112 were 1-12. In 1994 both the 110FP and the 112BT were 1-9, all other 110's remained 1-12.
In 1995, the 1-9 twist was standard for all models, except for the model 24 which was 1-14. All .223 chambers have a minimum freebore of .100".

[bigedp51]

All .223 chambers have a minimum freebore of .100".

Show us the Savage chamber print, my Savage .223 doesn't have your .100 freebore. Again if you can't prove what you say then its meaningless.

And "WHY" would anyone shoot military M885 ammunition with a steel penetrator tip in a bolt action rifle when its loaded to 57,800 psi.

If you want cheaper plinking ammo then shoot M193 ammo loaded to a lower pressure. It just seems very strange to post this in a reloading forum and make uniformed people think its OK to shoot in any .223 rifle.

Below from the H.P. White testing labratory.

https://i.imgur.com/eWiBhrF.jpg

This posting to me is no different than someone saying its OK to lube your cases and doubling the bolt thrust.

So again if you can not prove the actual throat dimensions of Savage rifles then its a Internet myth.

[J.Baker]

Some people just never learn....

Ed's warning is valid for any other brand rifles in .223 Rem and any aftermarket barrels, but as Fred noted above it doesn't apply to Savage .223 barrels because they use a non-SAAMI spec reamer with an elongated throat to nullify the potential pressure issue (i.e. eliminate any potential liability threat - real or imagined).

[bigedp51]

Who is sharpshooter (Fred) and how do we know his information is accurate. Did he work for Savage or what is his claim to fame?

And again why can't anyone supply a Savage chamber print and settle the matter

The Colt AR15 A2 HBAR is the only .223/5.56 rifle that has a throat longer than the standard AR15 type rifles at .0500 that I know of.

Below from the Savage manual.

AMMUNITION

USE ONLY THE CORRECT AMMUNITION THAT IS STAMPED ON THE SIDE OF THE BARREL.
THE USE OF RELOADS, HANDLOADS, MILITARY SURPLUS, OR ANY OTHER COMMERCIAL /
NONCOMMERCIAL AMMUNITION NOT MANUFACTURED TO SAAMI (SPORTING ARMS AND
AMMUNITION MANUFACTURERS’ INSTITUTE, INC.)/ ANSI (AMERICAN NATIONAL
STANDARDS INSTITUTE) SPECIFICATIONS WILL VOID THE WARRANTY.

Extremely short throat- what are my options?
http://www.reloadersnest.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=25687&whichpage=1

[Texas10]

And just to throw some wood on the fire: http://www.saami.org/specifications_and_information/publications/download/SAAMI_ITEM_211-Unsafe_Arms_and_Ammunition_Combinations.pdf

Page 8 lists 223 Rem.

[Zero333]

I've shot M885 in my Rem700 223 that has what I consider short freebore. No signs of over pressure but this ammo is far from accurate. 2moa at best.

[J.Baker]

As has been explained above (and repeatedly in other similar threads over the years), most factory .223 Remington chambers are deliberately throated long to prevent possible pressure issues is someone shoots 5.56x45 NATO ammo in their rifle. The manufacturers do this for liability reasons. That said, the official (aka Legal Dept. approved) recommendation from Savage is as follows:


Can I shoot the 5.56x45 NATO ammunition in my 223 Rem? 7.62 X 51 in 308 WIN? Savage Arms does not recommend the use of any military surplus ammunition. As stated in the owner's manuals, you should only shoot the caliber that is stamped on the side of your barrel.


Do with that information as you see fit.