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[foxx]

It would destroy the gun smithing industry, if not the whole industry. I truly believe it's grounds for INSURRECTION.

[Robinhood]

It would destroy the gun smithing industry, if not the whole industry. I truly believe it's grounds for INSURRECTION.

That may be what the ones in power want, Then it is marshal law.

[foxx]

So be it. You think I am kidding?

This kind of garbage HAS to STOP. NOW!


Ask yourself this: How does a new startup gunsmith even begin to be able to afford such a fee? It's NOTHING to the big boys, but absurdly expensive for the new guy. Completely contrary to principals of free enterprise and capitalism.

And it isn't limited to the gun industry, either. It's everywhere. We MUST object, under principal, or the whole country is DOOMED!

[foxx]

Suppose you "invent" a new and improved barrel nut... or trigger or spring... You won't be able to make it or sell it without first registering and paying the current fee of $2,500. If we accept this, then then what's to stop them from raising the fee to $5,000? NOTHING. and anyone who can afford $2,500 can afford $5,000 just as easily. I am telling you all, this is UNCONSCIENABLE and should have us all up in arms. LITERALLY!

[foxx]

Uh, oh... I'm getting riled up!

If it means martial law, I would rather he declare it NOW, while we still have our arms and ammo to defend ourselves with.

[foxx]

Suppose, for example, our good friend who started making custom pre-fit barrels out of his garage a few years ago was required then, to pay this fee or risk going to prison? Do you think he would have been able to start his small business and grow it into a small but viable, honorable and worthy business and serve us the way he has been? Heck, no, he wouldn't have. And who do you think has the most to gain from these kind of regulations? The big, existing companies. What they don't recognize, though, is how much their success depends, ultimately, on the little guy. By the time they do wake up and realize it, it will be too late for EVERYONE.

[Robinhood]

I agree with everything you said but it has to be a movement.

[foxx]

I understand.

I am saying we have to WAKE UP! Obama has done this all over the place, and Hillary will do the same. If everyone who get's bumped out of their little niche business or who is prevented from starting a niche business remains silent and unmotivated to act, then EVERYONE will be affected eventually.

It's hard to explain, but let me offer one more simple example I bet no one here is aware of...

Obama's Department of Labor did the same thing to ALL of us earlier this year. In brief, the DOL decided you, I mean YOU, cannot buy insurance or retirement products for your IRA if the salesman or financial planner that offers/recommends it earns a commission from the deal. I ask you, what right does the Department of Labor have to interfere with your relationship with your financial planner or insurance agent? NONE! But they did it just the same. Its only one of MANY examples and the people that think the way he does has every intention of managing your lives in EVERY matter possible, beyond your imagining, I assure you.

[foxx]

Furthermore, start a "MOVEMENT" and see how quickly you get added to the "DO NOT FLY LIST", or, soon to be known as the"DO NOT BUY GUNS LIST". or, "THOSE WHO DISAGREE WITH THE CURRENT ADMINISTRATION LIST".

[foxx]

Oh, Foxx, you are being ridiculous!

Next thing you is claim the IRS will target conservative-leaning Non-Profits so as to stifle them and their disagreeable agendas...

or the Secretary of State will willfully thwart the Freedom of Information Act and then be elected to the highest office in the land and, in fact, the world.

[J.Baker]

Before anyone else gets their boxers in a knot over this lets first try to get some clarification and more information before calling for a revolution. I can't find a single mention of it on GOA's website or the NSSF's website, and there's just the one statement from the NRA-ILA thus far. Everything else I've seen has just been a proliferation of the NRA-ILA's statement. Even this piece from Prince Law Offices, P.C. (https://blog.princelaw.com/2016/07/25/ddtc-issues-guidance-on-itar-registration/) basically says the same thing the NRA-ILA statement does without going into much more detail on who is and isn't required to register.

This (https://modernrifleman.net/2016/07/26/new-itar-guidance-to-squeeze-small-gunsmiths/) write up from Modern Rifleman offers a little more information in the third paragraph from the bottom regarding individuals threading their own barrels, but is it factual or presumed? He gives no reference to where that info came from or where it's stated.

So far the best Q&A I've found on this was over at 6mmBR.com in the comments to their post (http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2016/07/alert-feds-impose-itar-registration-burdens-on-gunsmiths/).

I've still yet to find anything pertaining to the language in 3a regarding "assisting in the design, development or repair of a firearm" and any/all forms of publishing.

[foxx]

https://www.pmddtc.state.gov/compliance/documents/ITARRegReqFirearmsManufacturers.pdf

This document from the state department clearly states that barrel makers and smiths who install barrels on an existing firearm must be registered and pay the fee.

Seeking clarification earlier this year, I sent an email requesting guidance and was told I could not convert a bolt action .308 to 450BM and sell it under a Class 7 manufacturer's license without first registering with the State Department and paying the fee. I was then invited to seek formal, written response from DOS by detailing my exact intentions, which I did, but was never responded to.

[foxx]

I just got off the phone with a representative from the State Department's "Response Team" (phone number listed at the bottom of their document sited above).

I was told they rec'd my inquiry, along with hundreds of others, and I can expect a response soon. From what I could gather, they have "bitten-off more than they can chew" with these regulations. They want to supervise EVERY gun manufacturer so as to determine whether they are making guns that threaten the safety of the American people but cannot afford to do so without charging high registration fees such as this. When in reality, it does not matter WHO builds AR-15's and sells them to a potential terrorist. If the AR-15 is a lawful firearm, and it ends up in the hands of someone hell-bent on destruction, it's gonna get done whether the firearm was assembled/manufactured in my garage or Bushmaster's factory.

[Apache]

I see this has made it here now......this story is spreading like wildfire. It's going to affect me and my business in a big way. If it isn't stopped, I will probably discontinue my business completely. I'll wrap up all of my orders then shut everything down. Then I will try to get on S.S. disability. I don't have any other choices left to me.

Most of the old timers know my opinion on this stuff and what I think about our government from the old days of the forum. All I can really say......it's become reality now. I'm giving it until I see how this plays out as well as how the election turns out.....then I will have to make a decision. Right now, the NRA is aware of it, my senators and congressman have been made aware of it......they are the only ones that have enough stroke to do anything about this. If they let this go........and it becomes law...........I'm done. I'm sure there are a LOT of small gun related businesses that are in the same boat.

[foxx]

It's the old "End-around" play...

The liberals will do ANYTHING they can to undermine the firearm industry and drive people out of business, no matter how small, large or inconsequential they are to the stated issue of trying to protect the American citizen. If you hate guns, there is no rational or persuasive argument against doing what they are doing. Once that is done, our entire way of life is destroyed because the common citizen will not have the means to defend himself and the rest of his countrymen against tyranny. That is FACT, folks, not an opinion.

[foxx]

Guys, listen to me, PLEASE.

I do not mean to make fun of or pick on Apache with the following information I will share with you all. I simply want you to appreciate the situation for what it is. For example...

I spoke with Apache about this this past February. He is clearly a very reasonable and level headed guy. He represents the best of our hobby and industry. But when I raised the issue with him, he really thought I was being ridiculous and maybe even paranoid. I clearly must have misunderstood the situation. In no way would these regulations affect his business or mine. He tried to reason with me and reassure me that I was mistaken. I wanted to trust his judgment, I truly did, because the ramifications and implications of MY interpretation of the situation was so earth shattering. Well, as it turns out, I was right. IF they continue to move forward with this interpretation of their responsibilities at the State Department, and they certainly say they are, it is the beginning of the end. And, even if Trump is elected and he overturns this on his first day in office, the damage will be done. Jim will not likely be back in business. Nor will I. Who cares? YOU should care.

PLEASE speek up! PLEASE call your congressmen and senators. This is REAL.

[Apache]

What Norm is telling you is absolutely true!!! I didn't think much of this when he brought it up. I really didn't think this administration would really be this stupid. I did see how it was setting up for a future version of this. My hope was that we would be able to stop this through the election processes........seems I was seriously wrong at this point.

I just didn't think it would happen anywhere near this soon. I was thinking this would take several years to implement this....over multiple administrations. It seems they are moving much faster than I anticipated.

Guys...I'm telling you, you need to get on the horn with you governmental representatives and make your voices heard. The "fundamental changes" this regime is making are doing some very serious damages.


Guys, listen to me, PLEASE.

I do not mean to make fun of or pick on Apache with the following information I will share with you all. I simply want you to appreciate the situation for what it is. For example...

I spoke with Apache about this this past February. He is clearly a very reasonable and level headed guy. He represents the best of our hobby and industry. But when I raised the issue with him, he really thought I was being ridiculous and maybe even paranoid. I clearly must have misunderstood the situation. In no way would these regulations affect his business or mine. He tried to reason with me and reassure me that I was mistaken. I wanted to trust his judgment, I truly did, because the ramifications and implications of MY interpretation of the situation was so earth shattering. Well, as it turns out, I was right. IF they continue to move forward with this interpretation of their responsibilities at the State Department, and they certainly say they are, it is the beginning of the end. And, even if Trump is elected and he overturns this on his first day in office, the damage will be done. Jim will not likely be back in business. Nor will I. Who cares? YOU should care.

PLEASE speek up! PLEASE call your congressmen and senators. This is REAL.

[tufrthnails]

Which EO is this specifically I was trying to find the actual order to read the order. https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2016/07/22/executive-order-delegation-certain-authorities-and-assignment-certain

[foxx]

I cant find the order, either. All i can find and all i have discussed with the State Department is their regulations as spelled out in the link i posted about 5 up from here. #32

[yobuck]

Prior to the last presidential election, Bruce Baer told me that if the president was reelected, he and most other gunsmiths would be forced out of business.