Bad Headspace Gage?

[dfrosch]

No measurements etched? Measure them for us. Use a 45 acp case deprimed and squared up if thats all you have. I don't think I'm ever going to buy anything from those folks.

Must be the Forster gages that are etched. You can see it in the link.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/345223/forster-headspace-go-gage-223-remington



SAAMI lists a maximum chamber length of 1.551 from the breech face to the datum line (.400 on the shoulder) and a minimum of 1.541.
Set your calipers to .400 and score the gauges, then do a rough measurement of the gauges from the head to the scribed line.
Post up your findings here.

Forster also makes gauges for the creed....

The Forsters seem to be less expensive than the PTGs.

[BillPa]

My Forester gauges are marked with the cartridge, Go, No Go and length. The PTGs and Clymers only marked with the cartridge and Go or No Go.

Bill.

[dividingfire]

I was able to find a set of Forster gauges. The big brown truck dropped them off today along with a new set of calipers. I will go down to the gun room this evening and get to work taking some measurements on the PTG gauges as well as comparing them to the Forster set. I will report back.

[dividingfire]

The Forster gauges worked out much better for me. I set the headspace on the Go gauge and then dropped in the No-Go gauge and the bolt would not close. Excellent.

After setting the headspace with the Forster gauges, I dropped the PTG Go gauge in and tried it. The bolt would not even start to close on it. I then dropped in the PTG No-Go gauge. The bolt would not close on it either.

The only thing I can say for sure is that the PTG Go gauge is set longer than the Forster Go gauge. I can also say that the PTG No-Go gauge is set longer than the Forster Go gauge.

I did take some measurements of the gauge protrusion before mounting the barrel. I can't speak to the accuracy of these measurements because the gauges did have some side-to-side play in the chamber. It is a difficult measurement to make accurately. The results are as follows:

PTG GO GAUGE: 0.1350"
Forster GO GAUGE: 0.1235"
PTG NO GO GAUGE: 0.1285"
Forster NO GO GAUGE: 0.1305"

These measurements are confirmed to be possible by the results from the gauge test, with the Forster GO gauge being the shortest and none of the others allowing the bolt to close.

I took some (poor quality) photos of the gauges next to each other for comparison purposes. Someone may be interested to see these.

The Go gauges next to each other. PTG on the right, Forster on the left:
http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad36/dividingfire/Gun%20Parts/20160322_191954_RichtoneHDR.jpg (http://s919.photobucket.com/user/dividingfire/media/Gun%20Parts/20160322_191954_RichtoneHDR.jpg.html)

The NO GO gauges next to each other. PTG on the right, Forster on the left:
http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad36/dividingfire/Gun%20Parts/20160322_192103_RichtoneHDR.jpg (http://s919.photobucket.com/user/dividingfire/media/Gun%20Parts/20160322_192103_RichtoneHDR.jpg.html)

All 4 gauges. From left to right: Forster GO, PTG GO, Forster NO-GO, PTG NO-GO:
http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad36/dividingfire/Gun%20Parts/20160322_192203_RichtoneHDR.jpg (http://s919.photobucket.com/user/dividingfire/media/Gun%20Parts/20160322_192203_RichtoneHDR.jpg.html)

[WinnieTheBoom]

Thanks for posting your findings. Glad the Forster gauges worked out better for you... My weariness of PTG has been confirmed and I'll be staying away from them from here on out.

Now post up some pics of the finished product :thumb:

[dividingfire]

It's nothing fancy. I'll try to take some decent pics this weekends.

[dividingfire]

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad36/dividingfire/20160325_181635_RichtoneHDR.jpg (http://s919.photobucket.com/user/dividingfire/media/20160325_181635_RichtoneHDR.jpg.html)

[Warrick]

That's a pretty sleek looking rifle, nice work.

[LoneWolf]

http://i919.photobucket.com/albums/ad36/dividingfire/20160325_181635_RichtoneHDR.jpg (http://s919.photobucket.com/user/dividingfire/media/20160325_181635_RichtoneHDR.jpg.html)
Very nice! Is that the Harvestor 30? That what I plan on getting once I move to NC this summer.

[dividingfire]

Yes it is the Harvestor 30. I love it.

[Hotolds442]

I've been meaning to post this up, thanks for the reminder.
So that its available via the search function, in most cases:
SAAMI minimum is the length used for a go gauge.
SAAMI minimum plus .004 is the length used for a no-go gauge.
SAAMI maximum is the length used for a field gauge.
There are always exceptions, of course, and all are measured from the datum line (which is sometimes hard to find without the proper tools) and the cartridge base.

[Hair_Boxers]

I've been meaning to post this up, thanks for the reminder.
So that its available via the search function, in most cases:
SAAMI minimum is the length used for a go gauge.
SAAMI minimum plus .004 is the length used for a no-go gauge.
SAAMI maximum is the length used for a field gauge.
There are always exceptions, of course, and all are measured from the datum line (which is sometimes hard to find without the proper tools) and the cartridge base.
Would you recommend LE Wilson case gage and a dial indicator?

I am still waiting on the PTG gauges I ordered 7 weeks ago and am thinking I should check them out prior to trusting them.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[sharpshooter]

I've been meaning to post this up, thanks for the reminder.
So that its available via the search function, in most cases:
SAAMI minimum is the length used for a go gauge.
SAAMI minimum plus .004 is the length used for a no-go gauge.
SAAMI maximum is the length used for a field gauge.
There are always exceptions, of course, and all are measured from the datum line (which is sometimes hard to find without the proper tools) and the cartridge base.

That is a simple explanation and in most cases right, but technically incorrect.
The difference from SAAMI minimum to maximum length is .010". The difference from a go gauge to no-go gauge is .005", with a tolerance of +-.001". The range of the go/no-go gauges have to fall within that .010" window of the min/max headspace length. This is called a geometric tolerance. So technically a go gauge could be as little as minimum length, to min. + .006". A no-go gauge could be as little as minimum +.004" to maximum length. Yeah, sounds confusing, but SAAMI specs are very wide, and most manufacturers use them as a "suggestion" then use what is called "voluntary industry specs" to keeps things in a more realistic realm.
Most of the general public believes that every manufacturer uses SAAMI specs in every aspect of chambers and ammo, and that is simply not the case.

[sharpshooter]

Oh, one more thing.....SAAMI doesn't call out specs for a "field' gauge. That is a military spec, being ,.015" longer than a go gauge.

[TonyBen]

That's a bummer! I've had a bad PTG reamer and a bad Manson reamer. I don't have a lot of experience with reamers, but my PTG had a burr on the shoulder, so only one flute was cutting the shoulder. I caught it before I finished the chamber and finally figured out what was going on. I stoned down the burr and finished the chamber.

On the Manson (had it less than a month), I reamed a new barrel, but in my inexperience, I didn't realize that the pilot was too tight and I pushed the first 1" of the rifling out maybe 0.0005". The barrel is probably still okay, but I ordered a new one anyways. I noticed that the etching on the pilot was worn on the first .2" but not on the rest of the pilot. The pilot was about an inch long before any cutting flutes were present. I drug out a B&S micrometer and the first .2" of the pilot measured 0.30000" (a .308 M852 match reamer). The rest of the pilot was 0.2998".

I ended up chucking the reamer in a drill and used a very fine stone to bring the oversized part of the pilot to match the rest of the reamer.

I haven't had a lot of luck with reamers. I do have a 10-piece PTG headspace gauge set for 308 and it seems to work very well. I've verified headspace in SAI rifles and they seem to be accurate. Headspace on a new rifle was about 0.002" over SAAMI minimum headspace.

Tony.

[pdq5oh]

I wonder if those gauges aren't for a 6.5 Sweed?