how to convince savage haters

[Luke45]

how do you convince you friends that hate savages to try one out?

you can shoot a 5 shot 1/3 moa groups in front of their eyes, change a barrel in front of them in 10 min, built a custom competition rifle for less than 1000$, cold bore kill coyotes at 600 yards, ect.

and yet they still insist on building custom 3500$ rifles with proof barrels and steller actions and stuff that give them nothing but problems and 3/4 moa accuracy!

are some people just impossible to convince????

[WinnieTheBoom]

Let them be. If they wanna spend big money on custom builds that net the same results as what you're doing, that's their prerogative. It's like those Remington fanboys that refuse to admit that their QC has gone down the drain. Just leave them to it while you go about business as usual.

[Robinhood]

Eat em and smile

[mikein]

Those kind of folks "lead with their wallet/credit cards" and cannot/will not be convinced. Most of them I've known love to give me chapter and verse, dollar by dollar, of who all and what all went into their custom rifle (that doesn't shoot any better than my factory Savage!). It's having more money than sense, and somehow getting pleasure, not out of the end results of the product, but being able to "impress" their fellow gun nuts with their investment in the product. I'm generally underwhelmed by the performance of said custom jobs, although some of them sport some really nice, highly figured furniture. You're wasting your time, so invite them to the range and have a shoot-off. If they and their high dollar rifles beat you, congratulate them and pay them off and be done with them.

[olddav]

You have to let people be themselves. If they want to spend 3K+ on a custom rifle and regal others with stories of its conception and construction then smile and nod approvingly. Go back to out shooting them your humble Savage rifle.

[devildogandboy]

it's all a status symbol, they have the money to burn! they don't care about results at all.

Bruce

[rjtfroggy]

You know it really is not hard to spend $3k on a Savage build, I know I did it. PTA, criterion barrel, Shehane stock, recoil lug nut, Kelby bases and rings, Weaver T36 scope. When all said and done doing everything myself total was just a little over $3100. But it certainly shoots very very nice little 0.165 groups (5 shot) and I have won my class in informal score matches just about every time out.
there is a build thread some where on here for it.

[Texanjohn]

In cars we race or "pink slips" ask them to but their money, or in this case rifle, where their mouth is, when you out shoot them with your " plain " old Savage then you will have shut them up, and they will no longer have a reason to go to the range.( unless they go out and buy a Savage)

[BlueDog]

TexanJohn, I think that would be a great reality show! I loved "Pinks", especially when they drug some jalopy sleeper to the line, then smoked the high dollar tricked out racer. So yes, I am saying a Savage would make a fine "jalopy sleeper" in the rifle world. I'd watch it.

[sc1911cwp]

aka "American Graffiti". Or better "Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome". Two men enter, one man leaves. One day, cock of the walk. Next, a feather duster.

[reaper06]

Let them be. If they wanna spend big money on custom builds that net the same results as what you're doing, that's their prerogative. It's like those Remington fanboys that refuse to admit that their QC has gone down the drain. Just leave them to it while you go about business as usual.
Very true. If you don't have a top of the line 700 that you dumped another 4 grand into then you are just plunking with a peashooter....until you take your Rem 710 out of the bag and are told that it's a garbage rifle and just a down right piece of crap. Then you shoot that guys lights out and he tries to come up with all kinds of excuses. I told him I know what you mean, this crappy factory ammo shoots nowhere near as good as my handloads....the look on his face was priceless!!!!!!!

I hope I run into him in a few weeks....I'm gonna ask him what he thinks of my budget Savage.....

[LoneWolf]

You know I started out with Savage rifles and do have a fondness for them, but for the competitions I run in, I had more reliability issues running a Savage than I have ever had running my custom build. It always shot accurately, but getting the round in the chamber or ejected from the action continued to plague me in a number of matches. I even had a firing pin fail on me! When I invest a lot of money traveling to a match I want to make sure my equipment will make it through the entire weekend! That's why I built on a high quality custom action, but I do run it with a barrel nut!

[Luke45]

You know I started out with Savage rifles and do have a fondness for them, but for the competitions I run in, I had more reliability issues running a Savage than I have ever had running my custom build. It always shot accurately, but getting the round in the chamber or ejected from the action continued to plague me in a number of matches. I even had a firing pin fail on me! When I invest a lot of money traveling to a match I want to make sure my equipment will make it through the entire weekend! That's why I built on a high quality custom action, but I do run it with a barrel nut!

What types of matches? PRS?

[LoneWolf]

I've done some PRS and our monthlies are in a desert climate. The savage action just couldn't keep up. Had no problems until the tougher more austere competitions.

[brfussell]

LoneWolf, is this a problem limited to Savage or have you seen other platforms have similar issues?

[LoneWolf]

I had more issues with the Savage action, as well as a Shilen DGR that uses the same bolt head. As soon as any sand hit the action or you were trying to run the bolt to keep up with the clock it started to show where it fell short. Bolt binding, double feeds, weak extraction. I got tired of continuous tuning try to get these things right. I ended up ordering a Mausingfield from American Rifle Company and have 0 regrets paying the price because none of these issues have plagued me since. I'm looking forward to the 2016 season with the new action.

[LoneWolf]

Again I'll reiterate that it was always just as accurate, but for me it failed in function when it counted most.

[LongRange]

I had more issues with the Savage action, as well as a Shilen DGR that uses the same bolt head. As soon as any sand hit the action or you were trying to run the bolt to keep up with the clock it started to show where it fell short. Bolt binding, double feeds, weak extraction. I got tired of continuous tuning try to get these things right. I ended up ordering a Mausingfield from American Rifle Company and have 0 regrets paying the price because none of these issues have plagued me since. I'm looking forward to the 2016 season with the new action.

this is good to know because im going to buy a custom action end of the year and the shilen was one at the top of my list...i guess its surgeon or defiance and leaning toward defiance.

[LoneWolf]

I would say the Shilen or a Savage action are great for the belly match range queen or basic hunting rifle ideals. But in my experience for more demanding competitions with lots of rounds and short timelines the guys that are winning are all using high end equipment with much lower malfunction rates.

Example of 1 type of Course of Fire:

When you only have 60secs to try a get off 8 good shots at 4 different targets at 4 different ranges in a sequence firing 1 round at each target then repeating that sequence. Every second counts. Most won't get all the rounds off to begin with. Timelines are set up to require a flawless or near perfect run. If your first round jams coming off the mag you may only get 2-3 good shots. Reliability is the key factor in action choice.

COF's are only limited to the RO's imagination. So sometimes you have maybe 0 to 60secs of experience doing some things.