DBM Feed Issues...Am I Doing It Wrong???

[JRussell]

I've searched and read some posts that sound similar to my problem, but didn't see any solutions.

I recently bought a used 116 in 270win and cannot get it to feed any rounds properly. The mag drops down 1/16" - 1/8" and doesn't catch the next round. It will ONLY feed a new round under the following conditions...

1) If I open the bolt, insert the mag (which takes a good amount of force and has a very quiet click), and close the bolt it will cycle just the first round.

2) If I push up on the bottom of the mag it will feed all rounds.

3) If I push a round in the mag further forward than normal it will feed, but if I load the whole mag like that the bottom rounds end up moving back and fail to feed.

It seems like the rear catch on the mag (metal tang) just doesn't line up with the lip in the stock. It catches, but by then the mag has moved down and won't feed.

Any advice would be GREATLY appreciated!!! Thanks!

[foxx]

First of all, is it the "Axis Style" mag with a plastic clip that comes up from bottom of mag to act as a catch/snap on the stock or a traditional 10/110 mag with a metal spring loaded clip on the bottom of the stock?

[JRussell]

This is my first DBM gun so not sure other than its a model 116. The bottom of the mag is plastic and it has a plastic clip on the fore end and a metal tang on the rear. Does this help?

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05/31/3b6473350a01b96eb6e36efaec542f80.jpg

[foxx]

Yep. It's an Axis style... gotta think about this... Might throw a bunch of crap at you to try...


first, make sure when inserting the mag, don't push it in straight/level. Instead, put the heal/back end in first, then push the front into place and be sure the plastic clip is fully set when done. It should not stay pushed back but rather pushed forward...

try loosening the action screws and see if it loads better or differently...

inspect the plastic clip edges and see if they are mutilated at all. they really need to have crisp edges and smooth...

does the spring and follower move freely up and down in the mag when you push on it with your thumb or does it get hung up inside???

[foxx]

know that the small metal clip on the rear of the mag box catches on the stock and needs to have a good solid/crisp, unmutilated edge to "grab hold of". My guess is that hard plastic edge/shelf that the metal clip catches on is worn out and the mag is not grabbing it right so its slipping down out of the stock a bit. That's why it works when you push up on it from the bottom.

[JRussell]

Thank you for the pointers! I have tried those things and it still did the same thing. It does seem to take a good amount of force to get the front clip to lock in, and when it does its quiet and there isn't much of a click feel.

I inspected the rear metal tang as well as the plastic ledge it clips into (in the stock) and both look like new. I thought about bending the metal tang but don't think that will really help. It's almost as if the metal tang is a little too short or the ledge it clips into is just a little too low in the stock. It does lock on that rear ledge, but you can push down when the bolt is open and see the rear of the mag drop down just enough to cause the bolt to miss the round.

[foxx]

That rear metal tang is likely to break off if you try to bend it out. (been there, done that).

Next, I would try to open up the sides and ends of the mag well just a bit so that the mag slips into it easier. Something is preventing it from seating properly.

Another cause might be that the action is not sitting deep enough into the stock. It sounds like the action and the mag are not mating correctly. They need to be held a certain position/distance from each other). It concerns me, too, if that hard black "ledge" is in like-new condition. If it's being used, it's gonna have some wear to it...

Also, try removing the bottom of the mag and re-seating it onto the metal box. It needs to be seated properly, too. It might on there cockeyed a bit. To do so, pinch the sides of the box down near the bottom piece and pull it away. Then, snap it back into place by first inserting the rear tab into the hole/slot in the box.

Finally, I can tell you I found that sometimes a different bottom piece or box will work with one and not another. They seem identical, but they aren't. I do know this: When it's all seated properly, that plastic clip is all the way forward. If it is depressed back against the box at all, it's not engaged properly. You might have to file the flat top of the plastic clip down a bit so that it will have the clearance to move forward and snap into place.

Finally, these Axis DBM's stink. Some of them work fine, but they are, in my opinion, just too dang cheap to be reliable. They are the result of a company's effort to make an inexpensive DBM for an action that requires better. stronger, more robust frame and other parts. (the original designs work fine, but are "too expensive").

[foxx]

Completely remove the stock from the action and see if the mag "snaps" into place better/ more definitively. If there's no difference, I have no idea other than to try another DBM or other parts.

[JRussell]

Thank you for all the help with troubleshooting this!!

I've tried what you suggested and found that the mag does not fit in the stock any better with the action removed.

Even though it's hard to clip into place the rear tang isn't resting on the lip. It's like the tang is just 1/8" too short and only reaches once the mag drops down enough to cause feed problems. Once the mag drops down it does catch and hold it. Here's a pic of the mag dropped down compared to flush...

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/01/9b29ec47dac892b28f209897d1f2baa2.jpg

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/01/d26789fdc06b38417c1bef094f04b8bc.jpg

[foxx]

IDK. Looks and sounds like the stock is whack. That "ledge" is too low in the stock. I'd call savage, because, if I'm right, it came from the factory like that. There's no denying it. I would think they would send you a replacement just because it's inexpensive and not worth denying the fact it MUST have come that way. No one could alter it without being able to tell just by looking at it.

[JRussell]

That's a good idea and I think will be my last resort.

Can I use the metal box from my blind mag 270 and snap the plastic bottom on? I don't think it will be any different but figured it's worth a shot (assuming the parts are interchangeable).

Lastly, is it possible to upgrade to real bottom metal or would that require a different stock?

Thanks again!!

[foxx]

Yep, you can try the other mag box, it's the same, assuming it's center feed. (Attaches to the stock, not the action)

In your case, the "real" mag requires a different stock.

[JRussell]

Just an update...I tried the metal box from my other 270 and it did exactly the same thing.

I think you're correct in that the stock must somehow be defective. That rear ledge inside the stock looks untouched so hopefully they will acknowledge the issue and replace it. I'm going to call them today and see.

I'm not the original owner but he bought it new around a year ago. He only put 1 box through it on a bench and didn't notice the issue since the rest was pushing up and holding the mag where it should be.

[JRussell]

Another update...

Savage sent a new mag and, although it looks identical to the other one, it works fine!

Are there other savage models that come with all metal DBM setups or are they only available via aftermarket companies?

[devildogandboy]

i had a problem that may have been similar to your, turned out the "front plastic clip" for the mag was keeping it from being inserted all the way. on the front plastic clip i could see where it was catching and marring the plastic where the bend is on the front tab. look at the pics and you will see where it was catching. i took a file and slightly beveled that small area until the mag went in without any problems and no longer marred the tab. i'll try to get some pics of the beveled area, it will take a while, i have to dig that rifle out from the rear of the safe. see if you have these marks on your mag.
http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb379/devildogandboy/IMG_0222.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/devildogandboy/media/IMG_0222.jpg.html)
http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb379/devildogandboy/IMG_0220.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/devildogandboy/media/IMG_0220.jpg.html)
http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb379/devildogandboy/IMG_0217.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/devildogandboy/media/IMG_0217.jpg.html)

Bruce


here it is after removing the botched area and it works now.
http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb379/devildogandboy/IMG_0224.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/devildogandboy/media/IMG_0224.jpg.html)
http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb379/devildogandboy/IMG_0223.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/devildogandboy/media/IMG_0223.jpg.html)

[JRussell]

I think you're right. My old one didn't look quite like yours, but when I put them side by side the front clip is the only part that isn't exactly identical.

I'm still not really clear on why that rear tab doesn't sit on the ledge inside the stock though. Even the new one is just as far away from touching the ledge as the old one, but I guess the added tension from a properly working front clip is enough to hold the mag where it needs to be. Seems like a bad design to me.

[foxx]

I'm with you, JR. If that rear tab and the ledge don't match, there's still something wrong. Have you tried the mag with 3-4 cartridges in it? I'm worried it wont hold with the added weight.

[JRussell]

I'm with you, JR. If that rear tab and the ledge don't match, there's still something wrong. Have you tried the mag with 3-4 cartridges in it? I'm worried it wont hold with the added weight.

Yes sir. Cycled a full mag through it several times and didn't have any issues. If I push hard on the rear of the mag (down through the open bolt area) it does move down slightly but not as bad as the old mag.

I'm looking for a take-off Accustock with real bottom metal as we speak. Don't care for all the plastic.

[JRussell]

Does anyone know if there's another factory savage stock with real bottom metal that would be a direct replacement? I was told the Accustock would need the barrel removed and lug swapped.

[foxx]

Yes, there is. I don't know what current models come with it. But there are older models, for sure.