Needing a 223 bolt action

[jamesp81]

The rifle would need to be lightweight and still be accurate...I understand that a sporter weight barrel will lose accuracy more quickly than a bull barrel due to heat, and that's a limitation I'm willing to accept.

My goal is to have something light enough for walking around and for offhand shooting, while mainting .75 MOA or better with neck sized handloads.

I am somewhat skittish of the Axis and Model 25. The Axis is so inexpensive that I have to worry about what corners were cut to get the cost down. With the Model 25 I'm unsure about the idea of a reworked rimfire serving as a centerfire.

I've looked at a regular Model 11 with synthetic stock, the Model 11 Lightweight Hunter, and the Model 11 Hog Hunter.

[Berger.Fan222]

I've shot a Model 25 in 222 Rem. Definitely not an action for larger bolt faces, but it is fine and accurate with the .223 sized bolt face.

The Model 11s are fine also. They may be slightly preferable because of the barrel nut and the ability for the end user to install their own replacement barrels. This action is a bit beefier also. The tradeoff is a bit more weight.

[foxx]

The hog hunter is my favorite of the Savages, but the barrel is a "Heavy Barrel" . Not sure it fits your criteria. If I was going for a lightweight carry, toss-around, "truck gun", I'd say the Axis is a good one. It's not the prettiest in my opinion, but very functional, practical and absolutely reliable. Barrel is the same, incidently, as any other Savage of the same dimensions.

If you're handloading, you should get 1/2 MOA at 100 yds or you're not trying hard enough.

[Digduggy]

600 bucks out the door for a 12fv/flv... 3/8" group out of the box with hand loads

[jamesp81]

The hog hunter is my favorite of the Savages, but the barrel is a "Heavy Barrel" . Not sure it fits your criteria. If I was going for a lightweight carry, toss-around, "truck gun", I'd say the Axis is a good one. It's not the prettiest in my opinion, but very functional, practical and absolutely reliable. Barrel is the same, incidently, as any other Savage of the same dimensions.

If you're handloading, you should get 1/2 MOA at 100 yds or you're not trying hard enough.

Yes, the Hog Hunter is a bit beefy, handled one at a store not long ago. It would be the upper end of my weight range.

I have concerns about the Axis as I mentioned above. Is it capable of the kind of accuracy you get in the model 11? I also admit that I really like the accutrigger and that kind of puts me off from the Axis.

[foxx]

Same accuracy. When I said 1/2 MOA I meant the Axis. Axis II has Accutrigger. If you like the Accutrigger and it's safety "blade", go for it. ( I do, for hunting guns, and it seems sometimes they are really good, sometimes they're just okay) Otherwise, get the Axis and put a Rifle Basix Sav-1 on it.

It's an economical rifle. Can't fnd anything wrong with it if you aren't looking to do a bunch of "upgrading" with aftermarket stuff.

[jamesp81]

Same accuracy. When I said 1/2 MOA I meant the Axis. Axis II has Accutrigger. If you like the Accutrigger and it's safety "blade", go for it. ( I do, for hunting guns, and it seems sometimes they are really good, sometimes they're just okay) Otherwise, get the Axis and put a Rifle Basix Sav-1 on it.

It's an economical rifle. Can't fnd anything wrong with it if you aren't looking to do a bunch of "upgrading" with aftermarket stuff.


Let me ask this: how many shots in a row can you get before it starts stringing shots from heat?

[foxx]

I don't know, mine is a varmint barrel. However, the .223 is a relatively light load. It may get 3-4 good shots from a sporter barrel within a minute without losing 1 moa. Then it will take about 5-7 mins to cool. I know my 30-06 gets 2 at most. Then they go progressively further right an inch a shot. Would not expect that with a .223.

Someone else can surely answer that better than me.

[David R]

I have the model 25 in 223. Its a great rifle. "Lightweight walking varmiter" 8,5 lbs. Shoots 5 in 3/8 on a good day, 5 in 3/4" on a bad day @ 100 yards.

The bolt moves with one finger, trigger is great. All I did was adjust to lightest pull. I shoot this rifle in an offhand 100 yard match on Saturday mornings.

Heat is not a problem.

http://fudpucker.smugmug.com/Motorcycles/Mypics/i-9nmf5QV/0/XL/DSCN4327-XL.jpg

[yobuck]

Well ive certainly not seen all the light 223 guns shoot. But my own experience is they dont shoot as good as heavier ones.
I wanted a light 223 carrying around type rifle also. So about 5 years ago i treated myself to a beautiful C Z lefty 527.
Well 4 guns and about 4 months later i got a refund from C Z for the gun cost. I had shipped all the others back and they agreed
that in their words, (THEY DIDNT PERFORM WELL). Last fall i traded my nepew for an almost new Ruger Hawkeye in 223. An almost
dead look alike to the C Z. Guess what, it dosen shoot very well either but not as bad. 2 shots might almost touch but a third is an inch or
more away in all directions. At least 4 of the major 223 powders and bullets from 50 gr to 69 gr all do about the same. The guy i traded to
recently bought a Savage 223 no doubt hoping for more accuracy although he denies that. He is also a camp member here and we got into
a dicussion over the accuracy issue. Ive even had this Ruger glass bedded and it didnt help. But you know what, that Savage dosent shoot any better.
Figure on 2 good shots before they start opening up. But the good news is both guns were good enough to get us both turkeys by 8 am on opening
day right from the camp porch at about 100 yds. Practice wobbeling in the right direction.

[foxx]

Sounds like Yobuck's is good enough to be a walking around / carry gun like you say. They are what they are. After all, how many shots does a guy want /need to take with such a gun? :)

[jamesp81]

Sounds like Yobuck's is good enough to be a walking around / carry gun like you say. They are what they are. After all, how many shots does a guy want /need to take with such a gun? :)

I'm envisioning it's function as a plinker, so more than you might think. For that matter, even when shooting for groups from a bench, my normal habit is 10 shot groups. I'd like for any 223 bolt gun I buy to be able to get through that many without stringing.

[foxx]

Get a .22. Seriously. No other light weight sporter barrel carry rifle will shoot well with 10shot groups. Heck, neither will any of my heavy barrels! Not a .260. Or a 308 or a 6 BR or .223. All varmint barrels. I dont have a .17hmr but I doubt it would either. By the way, your original post said you could live with that reality. Might want to revisit your thinking behind that cuz we are all stuck with it the way it is. :)

[jamesp81]

Get a .22. Seriously. No other light weight sporter barrel carry rifle will shoot well with 10shot groups. Heck, neither will any of my heavy barrels! Not a .260. Or a 308 or a 6 BR or .223. All varmint barrels. I dont have a .17hmr but I doubt it would either. By the way, your original post said you could live with that reality. Might want to revisit your thinking behind that cuz we are all stuck with it the way it is. :)

Maybe my perceptions of what is and is not possible were simply off. I assumed this would be workable since my Tikka 243 can get through about that many before it starts stringing seriously (though when it goes, it really goes).

As for the 22, I'm covered. I have a Savage Mk2 with a bull barrel. For walking about, I have a Marlin XT-22 Youth (laugh if you want, I have short arms). The Marlin is not as accurate, but you wouldn't expect it to match the bull barrel on the Savage.

With this in mind, I might re-evaluate and either get a benchrest / prairie dog type gun (This would be a Savage 12 of some kind) or just forget the whole thing altogether. I might do just this at some point, as I don't have a pdog gun and I'd like to try hunting them at some point.

[foxx]

The best solution is always" just 1 more gun."

[CharlieNC]

Another vote for the Hog Hunter. The medium weight barrel shoots long strings without a problem. I opted to put mine in a heavy Choate stock since it is only used for prone target shooting.

[JCalhoun]

All the Axis rifles I have seen are very accurate.

[mattri]

What about a 200? Sounds like it would meet all the criteria perfectly. OP never said it had to be new.

[Ibex]

I guess this is why you posted in the help me decide category. Seems as if your wants don't match real well with just one rifle.