Varget powder... is it "hotter " burning than most other powders?

[kenbo776]

I think someone at range told me that Varget was more likely to give more wear on barrels because it burns at higher temp . Does anyone have any input on this ? I like to use Varget but I also dont want to wear out my barrel any faster than normal. I do shoot about 200 rounds a month on average thru my .308 FCP so am a bit hesitant to use Varget very often until I find out the answer. So far have used Varget, BLC(2), Win 760 and Benchmark powders. Varget does very well with many of the bullets I shoot.

[Senderofan]

Checking burn rate charts and where they rank... BLc2... 105.BLC-2 (Hodgdon) and Varget 117.Varget (Hodgdon) . So Varget is a bit slower burning....not sure that equates with higher temps. The chart was found on "The Reload Bench."

I should also say that Varget is very popular in .308...and for heavier .223 rounds.

[Uncle Jack]

I don't know for sure, but if I had to bet, I'd put my money on BLc2....a heavly graphited spherical military powder as being the "coolest". I've been wondering the same thing lately and have been looking for a comparison chart or list of powders as to their burning temps.

uj

[82boy]

Burn rate chart off of IMR's website.
http://www.imrpowder.com/burn-rate.html

[Uncle Jack]

I wasn't asking about the "Burn Rate". Those charts are posted in just about every reloading manual. I was more interested in the peak temperatures of the powders.

Are their "Burn Rates" and "Peak Temperatures" the same?

uj

[Dirk]

What the others are telling you is true. In my research I was not able to nail down an exact burning temperture for smokeless powders but did find this statement on this (http://en.allexperts.com/e/s/sm/smokeless_powder.htm) website ......
"Faster-burning propellants generate higher temperatures and higher pressures, however they also increase the wear of the gun barrels."

[Tightgroups]

I know what your asking, but dont know of any info or research to answer your question, but I can tell you this, about 5 years ago I dissected a Federal 168g GM Match round, and it had 44.0g of Varget in it, and if its good enough for Federal and Hodgdon, its good enough for me. I use more Varget than all other powders put together, and I'm not worried about it.
All modern smokeless powder are a Nitrocellulose based powder, to my knowledge, so I dont know why one would burn hotter than another. But not to be confused with burning faster, and faster means hotter, most likely, but Varget is in the middle of the burn speed pack.
I do know the Navy did some studies in this area around WW-2, but they were talking about large naval guns.
The next time you see the guy that told you that, ask him where he gets his info.

[Dirk]

....but they were talking about large navel guns.


That would be NAVAL guns, navel is a type of oranges!

[jo191145]

Burning temps. Geez I saw this discussed on another forum not long ago.
There was a responder that actually had the answers.
As I recall Vhitavouri 100 series had some of the lowest flame temps. At least N-133 did.

Personally accuracy is first. Unless overheating your barrel in rapid fire is a severe problem I would'nt worry about it.
Lots of high power and F Class shooters choose Varget. While competitors are not overly concerned with barrel life they would'nt use a powder that ruins a barrel. And they run em fast and dirty.

Slower burn rates might have the same flame temp as fast burn rates. The slower powder will be distributing this temp over a larger bore surface area.
Equal temp over larger surface area equals less temp per area equals longer barrel longevity. Theoretically anyway.

In the end I'll still choose whatever makes the smallest group.

[viper9696]

With your 308 I would not worry the least bit about which powder will make my barrel last longer.take care of your barrel and don't smoke it with full auto type firing rates and when the barrel goes bad in 4000-5000 rounds,buy a new one,you see them all the time on here for under $150 its the cheapest consumable of a gun.so use the powder that gives you the smallest groups and lowest sd. ,es. and give the fps that you want. jmho

[EFBell]

....but they were talking about large navel guns.


That would be NAVAL guns, navel is a type of oranges!


wouldn't that be: A type of orange?

[Dirk]

....but they were talking about large navel guns.


That would be NAVAL guns, navel is a type of oranges!


wouldn't that be: A type of orange?

Now that would depend on whether you were referring to a single orange or a crate of oranges.

[EFBell]

I'm not an English professor by any stretch and I doubt you are either. I still feel you are wrong in your grammar regardless of plural or otherwise. To use the plural: Navels would still be a type of orange. If you want to reverse it you could say Those oranges are navels. I think you get the point. I feel it is entirely unnecessary and argumentative to point out every little typo or misspelling you come across.

Thanks and lets end the nitpicking.

[Dirk]

Being former US NAVY I felt it was my duty to point it out.

[EFBell]

God bless you for serving. Much appreciated by all of us. What is not always appreciated is your criticalness of others. There are several guys who post here that have a difficult time putting a simple sentence together. We don't crucify them for it.

[Uncle Jack]

I don't care what anyone says, I always enjoyed navel engagements.

uj

[Pulp]

Regardless of flame temp, pressure will increase temperature. If you double pressure, you double temp. If one powder produces 50000psi and an increased load of the same powder produces 52000psi, then the second load will create more heat. That's one of the first things I learned in chemistry, unfortunately it's also one of the last things I learned. ;D

[T-Rex]

Couldn't you pour equal loads onto a bench, ignite them and record the temps. Just mount a laser thermo pointed at the pile. What could it hurt to try. It just seemed too trivial not to mention.

[hotbrass]

Not really. You cannot ignore the effects of pressure on temp. or the burning rate under pressure.

[Tightgroups]

I want to thank all that corrected my typo, it added so much to the topic.
I also spent 4 years in the US Navy 1960 -64. Plus 2 years reserves.

After years of watching shooters check for hot barrels by feel. I did a little test on my 24" 308 shooting 168g SMKs with 44.5g of Varget at 2710 fps. And found I could hold on to the barrel up to about 125*F but not for long when over 130*F. I did this by taping the thermocouple of a good quality and vary accurate remote reading digital thermometer to the outside of the barrel 8" below the muzzle. And believe 130*F is well below a level that would be damaging to the barrel. So the next time you grab the barrel, you will have a good idea of how hot it really is, on the outside anyway.
Mike.