Cleaning question

[desmo]

If you use something like Shooters Choice to clean your bore do you need to use a separate copper fouling solvent after or is this built into the Shooters Choice solvent already? I am not clear on how many solvents you are supposed to use when cleaning your gun. One for powder fouling and one for copper fouling or do these new solvents take care of both at the same time?

Also what do you use to clean the solvent from your bronze brushes? I have heard use spray brake cleaner. Is this right?

[rjtfroggy]

I can't answer for shooters choice but with the Hoppes Elite I use #9 powder solvent and then the copper solvent. As far as the brush I just normally let dry then shake out before I use it again.

[82boy]

Shooters choice is a good solvent, but as with any solvent it still needs a good bronze brush to get the carbon out, and you need to let it sit in the bore for a few minutes and get the copper. You can do both with it, but you may have to periodically need to use something stronger to get the rest out.

[desmo]

So should you use a general bore cleaner first and then follow it with a copper cleaner every time you clean? Or should you just use the general cleaner each time and then the copper cleaner once in a while? A lot of cleaning instructions I've read online seem to mention the use of a copper foul remover following the general bore cleaning each time you clean while some say just use an all in one product like Shooters Choice or Butch's Bore Shine and no separate copper foul remover is needed.

Also how do you clean your bronze brush after it's covered in solvent?

[docsleepy]

I hesitate to even try to add anything to what 82boy has told you; he has much more expertise than I. The bit about waiting several minutes is important; this is a chemical reaction you're doing.

On my 6PPC I finallyk noticed something I had been missing before. I use a cleaning regime recommended by ONE barrel manufacturer (every one has a differnt slant on this): two very wet (Butch's bore shine) patches ffrom the action side, through a action guide, with great care taken not to rasp the crown edges. That wets it. When I'm paitient, I sit 10 minutes.... Then throughly wet a bronze brush and make multiple strokes (I do half what the manufacturer recommends) up and back, being very careful to just exit the front muzzle and not to damage the crown. The brush should have a rounded front, nothing jagged.

Then I wipe the ROD (coated, one piece Dewey) with a large patch (from a pistol or shotgun) and lay it down and wait, watching. If there was a lot of copper, it will look like a chromatography experiment from chemistry class: blue begins to wash out ffrom the edges of the black powder residue. If I see a lot of blue, I repeat the cleaning until I see only a little.

Then a few dry patches to clean it all out and a lightly oiled patch for preservation until next session.

The more I read, the more I become convinced that cleaning can do a lot of damage if you are not careful, and that a lot of cleaning is not necessarily better at all, than just the minimum cleaning to get the copper down to a minimum.


OK, I have no idea if the above is really the best, but one barrel manufacturer does recommend it. They say one stroke for every shot fired, but that seems crazy to me.

[maxima2]

Use Wipe Out or Patch Out - it cleans everything. No brushing.

Forgot to add: it really does not hurt the bore to leave it in for a long time.

[laportecharlie]

+1 on Wipeout. I run a couple of wet patches through to get most of the powder fouling out, then a dry patch or two and then Wipeout. No more brushes.
Charlie

[Don - LongRangeSupply]

Use Wipe Out or Patch Out - it cleans everything. No brushing.


That is all I use anymore. No way would I go back to those nasty ammonia copper solvents and the drudgery of pushing a cleaning rod / brush / patches through the bore.

At most total 6 passes of a cleaning rod with some patches (3 each after two applications with the accelerator) and the bore is absolutely copper and carbon fouling free.

An added bonus besides saving all that work is you run a lot less risk of damaging the crown or the throat the less you pass a rod / brush through the bore.

Be sure to always use a tight fitting bore guide and to not to let the cleaning rod bounce on the crown when the patch exits the bore!

[82boy]

So should you use a general bore cleaner first and then follow it with a copper cleaner every time you clean? Or should you just use the general cleaner each time and then the copper cleaner once in a while? A lot of cleaning instructions I've read online seem to mention the use of a copper foul remover following the general bore cleaning each time you clean while some say just use an all in one product like Shooters Choice or Butch's Bore Shine and no separate copper foul remover is needed.
Also how do you clean your bronze brush after it's covered in solvent?


I guess it all depends on what your doing, The part that kills me is people go out of their way to make sure that the bore is absolutely spotless, then when they shoot they shoot a few fouler shots to settle the barrel back in. The main thing of cleaning is to find a regiment that works to restores accuracy.

I have used a ton of products, everything from hoppes to home brews, and I will say some work better than others. Lately on non-molly barrels I just I push two wet patches of Montana 50 bmg solvent, and then used a Montana 50 BMG soaked bronze brush brushing it in and out for something like 10 strokes. I then spray the brush off with carb cleaner, and let it sit say 10 or 15 minutes. I then run dry patches through until they come out white. I then run a patch of colloidal graphite, and shoot. Is my barrel spotless clean? No, but it works. I find that when I get carbon build up I scrub it out with JB bore past and then follow up with Montana. I use to use GM Top Engine Cleaner, and sweets but do to problems getting GM T.E.C. I stopped using it. I cant say I have seen any accuracy gain from getting a barrel spotless, over clean.

On a Molly gun I scrub with a patch and a bronze brush and use RB17, I do not strip all the moly out, just clean it, and shoot. Works good.

It all depends on how clean is clean. If it makes you feel better to use a copper cleaner after shooters choice then do it. If you feel that shooter choice is doing the trick then do that. I do know that shooters choice has GM TEC in it, and GM TEC is one of the BEST carbon cutter out there. If you like wipe out use it, I found it did nothing for carbon, but I wanted to try Carb-out but never have. I talked to the maker and he told me about the same thing as my findings, He suggested I use carb-out with a brush.

I have found that any product without using a bronze brush will not remove the carbon to my satisfaction. I can not say I have ever seen a bronze brush destroy a crown. I see hundreds of benchrest shooters that pull bronze brushes back through bores and still shoot competitively. And they clean the gun dozens of times a day, most after every round of 5 to 10 shots.
Improper cleaning with damage a throat, no matter what. ultimately it all depends on what works for you.

[egavas]

Bore Tech's Extreme takes care of it all very quickly . Use a tough Nylon brush not bronze, especially if you're using an Ammonia based solvent.

[docsleepy]

I take the bronze brush and dip it in rubbing alcohol and sling it out a couple times and repeat, to get the ammonia based product off the brush so it isn't damaged.

great info above!

[egavas]

Good idea but, there is a chemical reaction between the ammonia and bronze that sticks to the inside of your barrell that is next to impossible to remove. That's why I use Nylon so I don't have to worry about it.

[82boy]

Good idea but, there is a chemical reaction between the ammonia and bronze that sticks to the inside of your barrell that is next to impossible to remove. That's why I use Nylon so I don't have to worry about it.


That is news to me, where did you get that information?

[Dennis]

Use Wipe Out or Patch Out

Or use Break Free foam bore clean! Both work for me!

Then I push a few patches through after cleaning the foam out.

[desmo]

Thanks for all the feedback guys.

I just got some Bore Tech Eliminator and will use this for any copper build up. I like the fact it's ammonia free.

I agree over cleaning seems to be an issue with many especially if you search for advice over the internet. I will do the minimum necessary to stay accurate.

[egavas]

Good idea but, there is a chemical reaction between the ammonia and bronze that sticks to the inside of your barrell that is next to impossible to remove. That's why I use Nylon so I don't have to worry about it.


That is news to me, where did you get that information?


In one of the various break in threads here or there. It may take a few but I'll find it for ya .

[egavas]

MAN I'm having a hard time finding that site with that info. It was on some precision gun barrel site where this guy was talking about breaking in match/precision barrels. He said if you have one of the two you really don't need to break it in. But if you must don't use a bronze brush with ammonia cause it it creates some kind of chemical reaction that will stick to the inside of your barrel that is impossible to remove. He is some kind of expert barrel maker using a bore scope. That's about all I can remember about it. And to correct myself, I ment to say Bore Tech Eliminator not Extreme.

[goblin141]

you find that site would you post link. I thought I bookmarked the site but cant find it now,

[egavas]

Yeah I'll keep looking for it. I though I marked it to.