Tuning for accuracy

[82boy]

I glanced through this post and a few things hit me. To start what is a "loose chamber?" My question is why wouldn't a fired round fit back into the chamber it was fired in? I would be upset if the round would not chamber back into the chamber it was fired in. The manner that Savage chambers barrel, can lead to the chamber being crooked, and you can tell this when you jamb a bullet and it will only partially mark the bullet. The thing is I have seen many of Savage rifles with crooked chambers, and it don't seem to hurt them any as far as accuracy goes. I would say that some of the best shooting Savage barrels I have seen had crooked chambers.

Now moving onto the accuracy problem, to start why are you shooting 5 shot groups? 3 shots proves the load, 5 shoots proves the shooter. Onto of that your shooting a sporter barrel ,and I would imagine that with 30/06 rounds the barrel heats up fast. This gun is not a Benchrest gun, don't treat it as such. Even with our Benchrest guns when I am looking for a load for a barrel we only shoot 3 shot groups, until we find a good load. Most accuracy problems come down to optics. Just because a scope is new, or a certain brand doesn't mean that it is good. Try another scope and see if it makes any difference. Also check to makes sure the mounts are tight, many aftermarket basses have screw that are too long, and bottom out on the barrel threads before the tighten down the bass.

What is a "called flyer?" I have heard this term used, but it makes no sense to me. If you know ahead of time that a bullet is going to be out of the group why would you fire it ? In my world a flyer is a flyer, meaning it is out of the group because either some was wrong, or the shooter made a mistake. In competition no one will let you get a do over because you called that flyer.

Seating depth is the most critical thing when dealing with loading, don't just try one depth. Powder charge is less critical. Don't get hard headed when dealing with seating depth, try everything from a hard jamb to jumping the bullet 95 thousands. Some barrels like the bullets jumped. Also pay attention to how the bullet mates up with the seating die, this can cause uneven seating depths, and concentricity problems.

Last try different things when cleaning the rifle. I have found ever factory savage barrel I have ever shot, shot better when it was dirty. I have found that most savage barrels open up groups when they are clean and it takes a few shots for them to settle down. Don't "fire lap" your barrel, all you will accomplish is extra wear on the throat and lead angle of the barrel.

[Volstandigkeit]

I glanced through this post and a few things hit me. To start what is a "loose chamber?" My question is why wouldn't a fired round fit back into the chamber it was fired in? I would be upset if the round would not chamber back into the chamber it was fired in. The manner that Savage chambers barrel, can lead to the chamber being crooked, and you can tell this when you jamb a bullet and it will only partially mark the bullet. The thing is I have seen many of Savage rifles with crooked chambers, and it don't seem to hurt them any as far as accuracy goes. I would say that some of the best shooting Savage barrels I have seen had crooked chambers.

Now moving onto the accuracy problem, to start why are you shooting 5 shot groups? 3 shots proves the load, 5 shoots proves the shooter. Onto of that your shooting a sporter barrel ,and I would imagine that with 30/06 rounds the barrel heats up fast. This gun is not a Benchrest gun, don't treat it as such. Even with our Benchrest guns when I am looking for a load for a barrel we only shoot 3 shot groups, until we find a good load. Most accuracy problems come down to optics. Just because a scope is new, or a certain brand doesn't mean that it is good. Try another scope and see if it makes any difference. Also check to makes sure the mounts are tight, many aftermarket basses have screw that are too long, and bottom out on the barrel threads before the tighten down the bass.

What is a "called flyer?" I have heard this term used, but it makes no sense to me. If you know ahead of time that a bullet is going to be out of the group why would you fire it ? In my world a flyer is a flyer, meaning it is out of the group because either some was wrong, or the shooter made a mistake. In competition no one will let you get a do over because you called that flyer.

Seating depth is the most critical thing when dealing with loading, don't just try one depth. Powder charge is less critical. Don't get hard headed when dealing with seating depth, try everything from a hard jamb to jumping the bullet 95 thousands. Some barrels like the bullets jumped. Also pay attention to how the bullet mates up with the seating die, this can cause uneven seating depths, and concentricity problems.

Last try different things when cleaning the rifle. I have found ever factory savage barrel I have ever shot, shot better when it was dirty. I have found that most savage barrels open up groups when they are clean and it takes a few shots for them to settle down. Don't "fire lap" your barrel, all you will accomplish is extra wear on the throat and lead angle of the barrel.

The chamber thing, I believe is a wash. I've moved on from considering that.

Groups, since the beginning of time the standard has been 5 shots, sometimes 10. Obviously a sporter barrel heats up faster, so the solution is to extend the time between shots. I've tried a different scope, with the same results. Mounts are all torqued and Loctited,mans have been checked several times.

To me a "called flyer" is when the shooter knows he botched the shot. Maybe that came from my military days, maybe it came from my youth. Either way I've used the term and heard it for years. I can see it supporting your theory of a 3 shot group, but still think 3 shot groups are something that came about from magazine writers realizing some of their advertisers couldn't produce a rifle that would shoot a consistent 5 shot group, therefore to keep from upsetting them,they went to 3 shots and sold it as gospel.

I've been working with seating depth a little, but until I can find the load that shines the most, it's hard to know what works best.

This barrel is no different that any other Savage barrel as far as preferring to be dirty. Jury is still out on fire lapping this barrel. I've done it in the past with no effect, as well as tightening things up. Never had it hurt a thing. If it does, it just gives me an excuse to do some more gunsmithing.

[oldbrass]

What range are you hunting ? I know we strive for the best accuracy but 1 3/8" group will drop any deer. I`d go with that and do my fine tuning during the off season. My -06 likes 165 accubonds over W760, If I do my part it`ll shoot 1 1/2" at 100 yards all day. The elk don`t mind

[Volstandigkeit]

What range are you hunting ? I know we strive for the best accuracy but 1 3/8" group will drop any deer. I`d go with that and do my fine tuning during the off season. My -06 likes 165 accubonds over W760, If I do my part it`ll shoot 1 1/2" at 100 yards all day. The elk don`t mind

250 max, more around 150. 1 3/8" is good enough, I agree. And is looking to have to be good enough this year. But next year will end up being a different story. I respect my quarry to much to not pursue better than what I currently have the ability to shoot.

[mudpig]

If you are getting several bullets touching then fliers...you might have a bedding issue. Have you checked for high spots in your stock? Pillar and/or glass bedding has helped my rifles in the past. What does your runout look like on loaded rounds? Do you have paralax adjustment on your scope? Just things to think about.

[Volstandigkeit]

Stock is fully floated. Haven't looked in to runout. No parallax on this scope.

[davemuzz]

Just to toss out a few other quick items to peek at: If your rifle has been bedded, be sure that only the back of the recoil lug is tight against the bedding. The sides of the lug and the front of the lug should not touch anything. Also, the barrel nut should not be touching anything. In addition, check (with a dollar bill) that your tang is free floated. If not, remove any stock material to have your tang not touching.

One other question: What brass are you using, and do you ever measure the diameter of the neck thickness of your brass?

Dave

[Volstandigkeit]

Finally got everything to work in my favor. Seems it likes 150 gr Nosler green tips over IMR4320 more than everything else I have in the cabinet. Slow fired, as in 2 minutes between shots, it will shoot a ragged 1 hole 5 shot group at 100 yards if I do my part. Got it figure out just in time too. I won't be home long enough to do anything with it for the next couple weeks, before heading to KY for deer season.

[RP12]

I'm basing that on my .223 700. Shoots lights out, and won't rechamber the brass I just ejected.

Will look in to some heavier pills for it.If it shoots lights out, aim lower, ha ha ha.

[drdonaldgrim]

How should I glass bed my new varmiter heavy barrel camo in 243? I have not shot it yet so maybe do that first. Don in Austin

[Ackevor]

Glad you found something that worked. If you do want to find other powder/bullet/seating depth combinations to work in that rifle, you can do the OCW/Ladder tests. They can, and may have saved you some time and headache with your rifle.

If I have issues with any rifles after I have done a OCW/Ladder test and found a good load, I first confirm at the range with a fellow Army buddy to confirm its not just the shooter (me). I then proceed to check that every single nut/bolt/screw/swivelstud is properly toqued to prevent any abnormal harmonic vibration issues that may arise or change during the shot string. Add what davemuzz mentioned and you should have a resolved issue provided there is nothing mechanically wrong with your firearm and you arent resting the barrel on anything haha, I see a lot... I mean a lot of people make this mistake during my trips to the range.