Help!! Bolt Lift mod / Firing Spring trim - Misfires !!! Youth 243 Model 11

[willies270]

The bolt lift on my sons 243 model 11 was really tight so I started searching around and did the .38 special brass ball bearing mod. After that it still seamed really tight so I trimmed the firing spring by this link: http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=450082 Also lubed it with antisieze. Went to the range today and the first 6 rounds fired then started missfires. I noticed the indent an the primers were not as deep as the first. Brought it home and measured the firing pin protrusion to be .065. cleaned all the antisieze lube off with gun scrubber, reassembled with some rem oil. Did not adjust anything just cleaned. Should I just get a new factory spring and put back to original settings???? and savage is saying I cannot order a spring because I'm not a gunsmith. Thanks

[Blue Avenger]

.065 is on the high side. 40 to 50 is better. adding the .38 brass with out a shim or shortening the screw reduces the amount of travel the pin has. lightening the spring compounds the short travel problem.

[willies270]

I forgot to add, I used a washer on the bolt assembly screw the same thickness of the 38special and ball bearing combo.

[seanhagerty]

I would remove the bolt lift kit you made and see if that solves your problem.

[Admin]

I don't know who "Bug Splat" is over on Calguns.net, but it's a perfect example of why it's never a good idea to try everything you see or read on the internet. I've never seen or heard of anyone recommending to cut the FP spring in the 10 years I've been running this site. In fact, those with far more knowledge about such things than I'll ever acquire have emphasized time and time again that even the "lighter" FP springs being sold by the likes of Dave Tubbs Speedlock and Wolf are a very bad idea. Why? Because the hard bolt lift has absolutely nothing to do with the spring weight - it's a timing issue. In other words, the hard bolt lift is being cause by different parts (cocking piece, cocking ramp, sear, etc) trying to work against one another due to the timing of their relative recocking events fighting against one another.

This is also why the .38Sp case head is just a band-aid fix as it really does very little to address the underlying problem. It reduces the amount of contact surface between the BAS and the cocking piece sleeve to reduce drag slightly, but that's about it.

So yes, you'll want a new firing pin spring to replace the one you FUBARed.

[thomae]

For what it's worth, if you want to lighten the force exerted by a spring, the correct way to do it is to reduce the diameter of the spring wire. Either use a smaller gauge wire for your spring, or sand/grind the outside of the coiled spring to reduce the functional "thickness' of the existing spring wire.

If anyone doesn't understand this, he or she probably shouldn't be messing with firearm springs.

Also, for more information on firing pin protrusion and setting of same, please follow the link to the article on this forum:
http://www.savageshooters.com/content.php?143-Firing-Pin-Protrusion-Data

Edit: Upon rereading this, it sounds all "know it all." That is not the spirit of this post. There are many ways to lighten the "feel" of a spring, but not all of them are actually lightening the force of the spring itself.

[stangfish]

I hope you don't take the truthful post above to harshly. The reality is you listened to a dummy and it caused your firearm to stop functioning. You might want to consider replacing those parts you modified and look at polishing and lubricating. Another thing is that some of the bolt handles coming out of the savage factory are not perfect and can cause or should I say contribute, to the timing issue mentioned above. A SSS bolt handle might make a marked improvement.

Another thing is that .015 extra pin protrusion means .015 more preload on the spring.

[willies270]

I appreciate all the feedback and before I trimmed the spring I was hesitant, but opted for a easy fix...anyways who can I get a new factory spring from. Thanks again everyone for the input.