The Ubber 338 cartridge

[handirifle]

Was watching the last few minutes of a show I had never seen before, The Pig Man, and he was another long range hunter, but mentioned he is a gun maker by trade. I have no idea who he was, but WHAT he was shooting caught my ear. He said it was a rifle and cartridge he had designed, and the cartridge was based on the 505 Jeffry, necked down to 338. I thought OK there's a bunch of 338 Ubber rounds out there, until he said it loosed a 250bullet at about 3400fps :o.

Wow! Looking at some of the rounds folks have mentioned here, that sucker really flies. I also noticed he must have one heck of a dandy muzzle break, cause when he fired it, you would have thought he was shooting a 243.

Anyone ever heard of the cartridge and what's it called?

[GaCop]

Nope, that's a new one one me. Talk about hand held artillery!

[TORCHRIDER]

Barrel life = 50 rounds. ;D

[Jamie]

A guy I work with had one of those and had a .375 off of it as well. I am not sure they have a name other than "a 505 necked down to .338".

[nuclabuyer]

I am fairly sure what you are talking about is a 338 allen mag, it is off a moded 408 cheytac case which came from a 400 taylor which is from a 505. I guess that would make the 338 allen mag and the 505 like 3rd cousins. I was going to get my 338 edge chambered it this, I dont even have my edge yet and I am already kicking myself for not going with the allen mag

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f95/338-allen-magnum-wow-41487/index2.html

Here is his website
http://www.apsrifles.com/Allen_Magnum_Wildcats.html

[handirifle]

I am fairly sure what you are talking about is a 338 allen mag, it is off a moded 408 cheytac case which came from a 400 taylor which is from a 505. I guess that would make the 338 allen mag and the 505 like 3rd cousins. I was going to get my 338 edge chambered it this, I dont even have my edge yet and I am already kicking myself for not going with the allen mag

http://www.longrangehunting.com/forums/f95/338-allen-magnum-wow-41487/index2.html

Here is his website
http://www.apsrifles.com/Allen_Magnum_Wildcats.html


I do not think I am into self torture enough for a beast like these. I feel like I am being adventurous with my 338 Wm :). It makes sense being based off the Cheytac. The Cheytac is an impressive round, but I do not see the military jumping on the lathe turned bullets idea anytime too soon. But for someone to neck it to 375 or even 338 is not too much of a stretch.

Wonder how long a pound of powder lasts in that reloading room?

nuclabuyer
What would you use yours for? Would probably drop an elk at 1500yds+.

[taos]

that guy is a moron!! Would not shoot anything he claimed to have built. The whole show is about his attention getting. I do not think the .500 has any more case capacity than a .378 Wby case , it also has a rebated rim. I think a .500 J. would be fun to play with but a wildcat on that case would not be much fun. My .338 would be a Lapua. My god 3400FPS with a 250 gr. Wonder if he has ever seen a chronograph? Also wonder what bullets hold up at that speed on 100yd. shots?

[nuclabuyer]

I would shoot steel and targets with it. I have a 30-378 that has the 338 edge beat as far as ballistics all the way to 1500 yards. I dont know that I would ever shoot an animal at that distance. But it would be fun to shoot, and I like all the big calibers, I am not into the 408 or the 50 bmg, I like the 30 and 338 calibers for some odd reason.

[handirifle]

taos
The Barnes TSX would easily hold up to those velocities. As I mentioned in my first post, I had never seen the show before, and I will not judge him, his gunsmithing, or his shooting, based on one 10 minute segment. As also mentioned, he said they are "almost" 3400, so I have no idea what it really is, nor do I have a reason to believe he is lying. I was NOT promoting this guy, his guns or the caliber, just wanted to know what it was.

I also doubt he is the first to make it.

nuclabuyer

The steel would be fun, and like I posted in another forum where a guy shot an elk at nearly 700yds, he is a better shooter than I am.

[nuclabuyer]

I would love to shoot it. On the website he says berger 300 is what he is shooting out of it. I am having trouble with my 30-378 and berger bullets, they are never making it to the target. I got an email about it and I really dont know if there is anything to do to fix it. Basically the long barrel and the friction that it produces is melting the bullet from inside, therefor the bullet come apart. I am thinking I am going to be let down by my 338 edge when it gets here. I am still kicking myself for not going with the 338 allen mag.

[taos]

I had the disintagration problem years ago in a swift. Only cure I know is to slow them down some. those bullets should shoot a long way in that case. My son shoots that round and shoots almost nothing else anymore. Took a bull with it at 890 yds. I have tried to talk him out of that stuff but he loves it, he has taken several bucks at over 500 and just keeps at it no matter what I preach.

[nuclabuyer]

According to Berger, it has to do with the heat hitting the bullet, making it weak. They told me they arent sure about a max RPM for the bullet but it was due to barrel length, and the size of the overbore makes it worse.

[handirifle]

Maybe with those velocities, you could go the way the guys have gone with the 6.8 SPC, a slower twist. My guess is even with the heavy for caliber, 300gr, one might get away with a 1-11 or 1-12 twist, assuming yours are the standard for 338's, at 1-10.

I realize this would be at someone else expense (ie., buying the experimental barrel) but if I were building a beast like this, I would be tempted to try it, especially if I were one of those long range shooters, and trying to squeeze every FPS I could.

[handirifle]

that guy is a moron!! Would not shoot anything he claimed to have built. The whole show is about his attention getting. I do not think the .500 has any more case capacity than a .378 Wby case , it also has a rebated rim. I think a .500 J. would be fun to play with but a wildcat on that case would not be much fun. My .338 would be a Lapua. My god 3400FPS with a 250 gr. Wonder if he has ever seen a chronograph? Also wonder what bullets hold up at that speed on 100yd. shots?


I am not sure where the Weatherby round would fall in this lineup but the case looks HUGE to me.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a7/Fiftydriver/338Edge338Lapua338AllenXpress338All.jpg

Left to right, 338 Edge, 338 Lapua, 338 Allen Xpress and 338 Allen Magnum with 265 gr AT RBBT.

This pic copied from another forum for demonstration.

[Jamie]

Kirby's rounds never dawned on me. He is a smith and lots of people shoot his stuff. It does have more capacity than the .378 Ebullient. Figure the. 30-378 and the. 300 RUM are in the same ballpark, 100 fps or so. The fellow on Mac's Gunworks site had one built (.375-408) in a handgun. Not sure of his longest kill with it but I do know he has no issue with deer and antelope out to 1k with his other handguns.

[yorketransport]

I think the big Weatherby case falls between the 338 AX and the Allen Magnum.

I considered having a 375 Allen Express made, but went with the 375 Rum Improved instead. Kirby puts out an amazing product, but for as often as I'd shoot it I just couldn't rationalize the price.

Andrew

[efm77]

Wouldn't you have to get some sort of custom action for a round that big? Seems the Allen Magnum case would be too big for a Savage, Remington, Winchester, etc. to handle.

[yorketransport]

Wouldn't you have to get some sort of custom action for a round that big? Seems the Allen Magnum case would be too big for a Savage, Remington, Winchester, etc. to handle.


Yup. You could use the smaller Allen Express rounds based on the Dakota case in a Savage though. There are a couple of manufacturers making actions big enough for the Chey-Tac case. They don't come cheap though! :o

Andrew

[efm77]

No they don't! Yeah I thought the Allen Express looked like it was about that size or somewhere in between the RUM and Lapua case diameter. I'm pretty tolerant of recoil but I believe it would be a challenge to handle one of those.

[handirifle]

Yea everything comes at a price. Cost of the rifle, cost of ammo, and a cost at the shoulder. Like I mentioned earlier though, he looked to have, what must have been a killer brake, cause his looked like a 243 when it went off. I would hate to be off to the side of that thing though.