Annealing before fireforming

[durango]

Waiting for my new barrel in 223 AI. I have 1X LC brass to be fireformed. Is it necessary or recommended to anneal before fireforming? My Lee collet die instructions caution against extra soft annealing. What are the experiences of all you AI veterans? Thanks, Steve

[bootsmcguire]

When I put together my 243AI I just loaded up some 1X brass and went shooting. Worked great, they now have quite a few firings on them and still working just fine. I would say any more than 1X and you may have issues, but I have only used virgin and 1X in my forming.

[dcloco]

Is your 1x fired LC from a machine gun or AR?

If machine gun or full auto AR, I would recommend annealing first.

[dukeflr]

Why would a machine gun or FA affect the brass differently? I understand some pieces get beat up pretty bad on ejection. I have always just looked the brass over and chucked the pieces that looked bad. Most of the 223/5.56 ammo is shot on semi and not FA. With that being said, I am close to clueless about annealing and by no means an expert reloader. I too am waiting for my 223AI barrel and could learn from this thread.

[bootsmcguire]

I would imagine that the heat from full-auto fire would harden the brass just a bit.

[GaCop]

I've never annealed when fire forming brass in my 223AI and have had zero problems.

[Eric in NC]

You will get best results with new (unfired) brass, but 1x in 223 AI should be ok (it doesn't have to expand much unlike 22-250 or some other cases).

[Waskawood]

I would imagine that the heat from full-auto fire would harden the brass just a bit.


Heat does not harden brass as it does carbon steel. Brass hardens from working it. The stretching and reshaping of firing and re-forming it during the reloading process. If in doubt anneal it first. It will not hurt if done properly and can only help.

[bootsmcguire]

I would imagine that the heat from full-auto fire would harden the brass just a bit.


Heat does not harden brass as it does carbon steel. Brass hardens from working it.


Duh, I must have been having a "brain lapse" kind of moment. Teach me to stay up cruising the site til midnight. :D

[gotcha]

Like gacop & eric say, can't see 1x being a problem. Like Lee says if you're new to annealing there's a lot to learn. VERY easy to over anneal & end up with brass so soft you can crush a case between your fingers. Probably not a good time to try & learn a whole new discipline. Best to learn annealing w/ old junk range brass. You could easily go through dozens of cases before you get the "hang" of it. If you posted a Ques. here about how to do effective, consistant annealing you'd get so many conflicting answers your head will spin.

[GaCop]

Is your 1x fired LC from a machine gun or AR?

If machine gun or full auto AR, I would recommend annealing first.


+1. The chambers on machine guns are set a bit "sloppy" to allow for the higher operating temperatures, and to insure all rounds will chamber and fire. The brass takes a real beating.

[airaddict]

I just fireformed some 1x lc brass in my 223 ai. Worked good and i got sharper shoulders cuz those rounds were meant for another rifle and the rounds were jammed into the lands a bit. My other gunshow new reloads didnt get sharp shoulders but did for the most part fireform 96% or so. I did have a few fail to light off the first time around cuz they were not tight in the chamber amd i had 2 pierced primers. But i got really good accuracy.

Even my nickle brass fireformed better than expected!

Brian

[GaCop]

I would imagine that the heat from full-auto fire would harden the brass just a bit.


Heat does not harden brass as it does carbon steel. Brass hardens from working it. The stretching and reshaping of firing and re-forming it during the reloading process. If in doubt anneal it first. It will not hurt if done properly and can only help.


+1